[AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

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Breeze One

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Post 2017.08.08 03:01

[AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

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FC: Breeze One
2IC/Anchor: Decklin (also Prober)
Scouts: Troven, Ashahara, Zarquu, Union
Dictors: Adrien Claremont, B'aldrick

MVP : Troven Smalvard, king of the wormholes!

So, rather than visit the usual Null Sec locations, I put a bounty out for Null Wormhole connections from LSC. I especially offered 25mn ISK for a connection to Delve or Provi - usually a pretty long shot. Troven however decided to make the most of this, and got me a route which took us to both :lol:

Now, Talwars arent the best fleet for hunting ratters in Provi, ideally for that you'd bring Combat Ceptors or another fast fleet with tackle which can shotgun a system, but who am I to turn down a trip to the fabled land of ratters and easy kills!?

I called for a few more Interceptors for tackle, and made sure we had some combat probes, and we headed out!

Truly it was the promised land....we almost immediately popped a Helios who was AFK on a gate

Helios +34.76m

Then our scouts caught a fat golden Turkey bird who we roasted with Nova missiles

Prophecy +111.65m
Capsule +0.01m

We spent a while (podssibly too long) chasing a VNI who, rather than docking up when he saw our scouts, instead started bouncing between safe spots, much to the frustration of our probers. Ultimately he escaped, so we blew up his MTU out of spite

Mobile Tractor Unit +9.45m

A Chimera started following us around at this point, and he caught one of us by suprise before we started evading him fairly successfully. Glen checked his name with the Spectre guys who confirmed he was likely bait who we didnt want to mess with (my initial thought as well given our numbers and single Griffin)

Capsule +0.01m
Talwar -7.16m

Despute the Chimera and a few friends chasing us, we got two nice kills in system of a Vexor and a cheap fit Typhoon with a nice pod

Vexor +21.1m
Capsule +0.01m
Typhoon +185.61m
Capsule +76.71m

We also snatched a Caracal who jumped into us, although his pod escaped our bubble

Caracal +33.48m

We spent a while fruitlessly probing down various targets in a ratting pocket before a Dominix was spotted warping gate to gate. We got ahead of him, and bubbled up both sides of the gate. We forced him though, then slowed him down enough when he tried to crash gate, and he was finally forced to aggress, securing us the best kill of the night

Dominix +314.27m
Capsule +5.48m

Hanging out hunting on a gate, our bubble caught a Thorax warping over who got blapped pretty fast

Thorax +47.61m

Then, we engaged a Brutix Navy Issue on a gate. We were burning through his Hull tank when the cyno went up. We were still partially bubbled when the Chimera jumped in, and FC had burnt the fleet out of the bubble, but hadnt aligned the fleet to anything :roll: so a couple of us died to the Chimera before we warped. My bad guys, not saying we would have escaped with no losses, but if I'd have kept us aligned we definitely would have lost less

Capsule +0.01m
Stiletto -31.68m
Talwar -9.32m
Talwar -32.88m
Talwar -7.94m

At this point we packed up and headed home via the Hi-Sec route from Dital. Job well done boys!

Stats
ISK Destroyed: 840,159,963.58
ISK Lost: 88,980,609.81
ISK Delta: 751,179,353.77
Efficiency: 90.423%

SPOILER WARNING!
Roam members (28) - NOTE: This section is NOT usually included in AARs.
Adrien Claremont
Ahab Ozran
Azrael Feanorian
B'aldrick Aivoras
Beavis Alland
Breeze One
DeanSherman
Decklin Quark Reiger
DonkeyPunch Udan
Eddie Dante
Genwhi Thellere
Glen Burney
Grisly Reaper
Mammad Bathana
Memery Rowkay
Oh' Leeador
Peregrinus Zolt
SMBEHJ
Tom Endares
Torg Navatin
Trillian Ituin
Troven Smalvard
Union Pivo
Z0X Ambrye
Zana Fehrnah
Zarquu Fussuhfusus
Zeerse Solaris
ashahara
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Troven Smalvard

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Post 2017.08.08 06:41

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

Breeze One wrote:Troven however decided to make the most of this, and got me a route which took us to both :lol:



And only one minor wrong turn on the way, had the map upside down :facepalm: obvious book mark is bait



Thanks to Breeze for taking the usual roam format to somewhere unusual and for me felt like he managed Talwars and tackle warp ranges well for application.
Many scoots, (and someone needs headphones or mute speakers on push to talk! :p ) and we were probably more rowdy than usual so well done trying to keep all the leash's taught.

Peoples thoughts on how best to improve that part, we weren't true shotgun as only 3 cepters, so had to be a little selective on system entry and narrow scan first. I tend to talk out loud what i'm doing constantly which is fine when i'm solo scout but does it help or hinder with multiples?
and me naming long green sites on specualtive was confusing for Laser last week but don't want us wasting double ups with so few of us?
I know we were getting a lot of repeat intel, but that is better than none for me?
Was mentioned during but if we find, shut up get there, tackle then www and talk, don't slow ourselves down jabbering ( general note for everyone including me)
For budding scouts who want to be upfront in the future multiple tailored overviews and dscan settings are a must for speed, i'm refining mine as i go but use at least 3 diff on a mission like this.

I keep saying it, but i'm always happy to spend time 1 on 1 in game on the basics with anyone who wants to try, i'm biased but i find it the most fun as you're finding the content for your friends. Fresh scouts also provoke less skittish enemies especially where we regularly roam.
I will eventually get something in the calendar (been saying this for months) but i'm easier to pin down in slack or in game for ad hoc


Combat probing and punting seemed to work OK, we definitely don't get the phoon and a couple of others without it,
we could probably have coordinated a little better on that, with a 2 minute planning on who was staying with the prober by default or some plan before we started, but more practice more catches.


TL:DR
all in all started calm and fleet really got going, provi is great!
I learned i'm red all over which explain a few things earlier in the night before the fleet;)
And most of all i had lots of fun and stayed up way too late , GF, 5/7 spooky space, malediction is king etc would dive and fly again

obligatory :rainbowwild:
Last edited by Troven Smalvard on 2017.08.09 04:56, edited 1 time in total.
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Eddie Dante

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Post 2017.08.08 07:08

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

What happens regularly too is the fleet waiting on a gate while scouts are in the next system. Meanwhile, an unsuspecting neutral is catching up to us and warping straight into the fleet. To be on top of this, its good if fleetmembers keep an eye on local (ctrl-a the local list), every time someone jumps in, start watching dscan.
This granted us at least the Dominix kill this fleet (i think also the helios?).

And yeah, nice fleet! If we wanna go to null again ill help probing out a providence WH.
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Breeze One

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Post 2017.08.08 09:43

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

Aye it's a good call Eddie. I was also getting better towards the end of calling for bubbles on gates where we were waiting so we could camp it a bit. I was also throwing up bubbles specifically to throw off pursuers sneaking up from behind, particularly that Chimera

And yeah, comms was a bit messy at times with 5-6 people scouting ahead, though in my view that was basically just one or two of those people who felt the need to maintain a stream of (mostly irrelevant) consciousness when scouting. I've just had to learn to deal with that one

For what it's worth Troven I thought you got a great balance of information without unnecessary chat. Some people were quiet, some talk too much :roll: but I always feel like I get just the right amount of info from you when you scout for my fleets - strongly encourage anyone wanting to learn scouting to take Troven up on his offer of some 1:1 classes!
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Raido Kudonen

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Post 2017.08.08 14:52

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

Talwars are an amazing doctrine for null roams, less for catching blingy ratters (which are difficult to kill with combat ceptors, talwars, and other smaller ships - I'd use Jackdaws or Cynabals for fast-warping, high DPS roams) than for baiting out a response force and dunking it.

You also learned about Provi's love for slinging caps (and supers) around against things that can't possibly beat them; I assure you that they are far less likely to do this against ships that can fight caps or against groups that have their own caps. Or they are now, after losing 3 supers in a week. :joy:
"What is good in life, Raido?"
"To crush your enemies. To see them bubbled before you, and to hear the lamentations of their carebears."

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Zeerse Solaris

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Post 2017.08.08 19:06

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

I'm not sure Uni comms will ever clear up. The only solution is to become stricter which is either an individual FC choice per fleet or something for management if it's bad enough, which to be honest, it probably isn't.

Maybe ground rules up front may have helped, but I think it's more bad habits that will only be broken if pointed out, and we're then bleeding more into just general social behaviour.

The fleet was good, I'm assuming we've tried a full shotgun fleet and it hasn't worked? Generally, I thought we should have spent no more than a couple of minutes chasing any one target. We were trying to work off surprise so it's best to keep on the move, either we'll catch something quickly or we won't.

Effective combat probing really needs focus and concentration to get it done quickly, multiboxing not great for that.

Good to see a uni fleet trying something a bit different.
E-uni Teacher:: Apply to be a teacher
E-uni Mentor: Apply to be a mentor
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Grisly Reaper

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Post 2017.08.08 21:23

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

It would be great if next time scouts whisper to FC instead of speak all together at the same time in the channel while FC trying to coordinate the team. Half of the time I didn't hear FC voice behind others and died bc of it.
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Troven Smalvard

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Post 2017.08.09 05:20

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

Zeerse Solaris wrote:I'm assuming we've tried a full shotgun fleet and it hasn't worked?


the uni has/does shot gun fleets to various degrees of success, just this particular fleet was not planned as one.
Was still to be doctrine Talwars for range and alpha strike just as Null route was requested to known ratting systems more weight than usual given to scout/tackle wing to try and take advantage of that.

As Breeze only got his confirmed null locations less than hour or so before undock (not just from me, others provided chains too) plan was made a little on the move - plus cepters and dictors being a little more skill point intensive than Talwars less people able to switch to those at short notice.

Zeerse Solaris wrote:I'm not sure Uni comms will ever clear up. The only solution is to become stricter which is either an individual FC choice per fleet or something for management if it's bad enough, which to be honest, it probably isn't.


your right, it wasn't perfect and never will be in uni, but it wasn't terrible either, i'm trying to be overly conscious of the fact i have a decent idea of what the normal fleet movement patterns are (and the fact had scout intel so i knew the hunting route ahead of time) so its not to hard for me to manage and filter chatter.
I know especially new pilots will not have that without concentrating much more and need to be able to hear all movement orders clearly and also they want to be learning what and why we are doing what.
Uni is here to teach new skills which is why i'm trying to give myself a hard time about it as much as i can for personal progress and not be too casual on organised fleets (plenty of ad hoc ganking for that :) )

Grisly Reaper wrote:It would be great if next time scouts whisper to FC instead of speak all together at the same time in the channel while FC trying to coordinate the team. Half of the time I didn't hear FC voice behind others and died bc of it.


Its an idea I think worth trying, up to FC's obviously, I have been on NPSI fleets where use this method more to maintain OPSEC on BLOPS etc.
The main channel not hearing the intel means they don't know when its being passed and may be speaking over that without knowing, should be fairly easy to solve with priority speaker roles on mumble and FC calling for check when they receiving.
Just means quiet comms in the main fleet more of the time and not necessarily knowing there is activity going on and may or may not think we are just spinning waiting on nothing. all about balance i guess.


All views expressed my own and in no way volunteering to FC fleets if it sounds like i'm talking from position of authority or knowledge :D
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Breeze One

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Post 2017.08.09 06:51

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

Troven is spot on. I love Shotgun fleets, but this time the Provi Wormhole connection was unexpected, so rather than waste time reshipping, we went to have as much fun as we could with the fleet we had. I'd say we were pretty successful. The joys of wormhole diving - you never know where you'll end up, and you work with what you get

The reason we tend to have scouts in the same channel as everyone else on Mumble is really for learning purposes. Let's fleet members hear the Intel scouts are giving and see the decisions the FC makes and learn from it. That usually works fine with 1/2 scouts, but in this case with the 5/6 we had, it started to break down a bit

I don't want to overemphasize the comms though. In general, Uni comms has been very good recently, at least on fleets I've led or joined. No messier than most other Corps anyway. This was just a bit of an unusual case due to the number of scouts, and a style of hunting a few of the scouts were a bit unfamiliar with. Plus one or two scouts who were more chatty than is usually helpful on any fleet (You may have heard my patience wearing thin with that a few times :roll:)

Sorry about your loss Grisly! Next time we have a situation with so many scouts I'll think about splitting comms a bit as you suggest. Probably a good shout in those situations.
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B'aldrick Aivoras

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Post 2017.08.09 13:59

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

Really enjoyed the fleet especially as I got to use my bubbles! I think I mentioned in fleet that it is probably worth keeping a cloaky dictor with the fleet for offensive purposes and for dropping a bubble on the out gate when running away.

At least I didn't bubble the fleet! o7


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Budda Sereda

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Post 2017.08.12 14:24

Re: [AAR] Police Academy Talwars go to Provi

The reason we tend to have scouts in the same channel as everyone else on Mumble is really for learning purposes.

I would say this is also more engaging: having quite comms for a minute while scouts doing their job and whisper with FC is just boring.
Join in-game "Budda's Fleet" channel for impromptu activities and quick updates on my future fleets.

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