EVE University Forum

Vukae Dhoul wrote:I have a suggestion which I have been pondering for some time. Simply put: short classes. At the moment most classes appear to range between 90 minutes and 2 hours, and go into a topic in great depth. Don't get me wrong, this is awesome: they contain a huge amount of information. However, I wonder if there isn't also a place for classes of say, 20 minutes with a 10 minute Q&A.

These would be a much lighter time commitment for both students and instructors (and so might attract more of both). They would act as primers (and adverts) for longer, more detailed classes, or overviews for people wanting a basic appreciation of a topic.

One could imagine these might either be high level overviews of topics (e.g., "What is Sov Null?") which provide a flavour of a topic without any of the nitty-gritty detail, or more detailed classes on much more specific topics (for example, "Jump Clones", "T1 Caldari cruisers for PVP" or "Hybrid weapons systems").

I don't see these replacing the current offerings, but providing a supplement to them.

A good idea, and one we can ask our all-volunteer teaching staff to implement.

Meanwhile, here are some suggestions for shorter format content:
- Check out Seamus Donohue's excellent series of videos on a wide variety of EVE Online topics: http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCghrb5gQXsVXzECjSs0gnKA
- Attend Seamus' weekly Q&A on EVE mechanics - it runs every Sunday at 03:00 EVE time - any and all questions welcome.
- Hang out in the Public Lounge on Mumble and ask questions there - someone will have an informed opinion almost all the time there.
- Post questions in the specific Q&A forums

Thanks for the suggestion - we'll see if we can get our teaching staff to do it.

Another thing, a lot of classes have a slideshow to go along with them, a PDF or google docs online - great! Visual learning FTW!

However, if I'm listening to a recorded class, much of the time I can't find that link retrospectively.

In some class threads, the lecturer posted the link, fantastic, and on the class library a lot of links are posted, but it would be great if that was made 'standard practise' in the initial announcement thread. Might also save the link being reposted a dozen times during the first quarter of a lecture for late arrivals

Iasis Rain wrote:Another thing, a lot of classes have a slideshow to go along with them, a PDF or google docs online - great! Visual learning FTW!

However, if I'm listening to a recorded class, much of the time I can't find that link retrospectively.

In some class threads, the lecturer posted the link, fantastic, and on the class library a lot of links are posted, but it would be great if that was made 'standard practise' in the initial announcement thread. Might also save the link being reposted a dozen times during the first quarter of a lecture for late arrivals

Agree that it's good form to reference the syllabus on the wiki and also any link to A/V aids, for the class recording. I'll prod our teachers and guest lecturers about it.

If you are looking for a visual aid, be sure to search our syllabus library for the class - the link is probably in there. http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Category:Syllabi

Vukae Dhoul wrote:I have a suggestion which I have been pondering for some time. Simply put: short classes. At the moment most classes appear to range between 90 minutes and 2 hours, and go into a topic in great depth.
...
These would be a much lighter time commitment for both students and instructors (and so might attract more of both). They would act as primers (and adverts) for longer, more detailed classes, or overviews for people wanting a basic appreciation of a topic.

I agree, and not only because I have difficulty talking for more than 1 solid hour.

There are some syllabi I have noticed are growing large enough to be split from a huge 101 class to smaller 101/102/201 classes. It's entirely possible for people to stay and ask for "more info" after the official class, but it still permits people who need to break away to know they're catching up on whatever the syllabus didn't include the next time.

Short overviews could logically be considered "100" classes, unless the Uni prefers to stick to the familiar "101" schema. (My provincial uni uses X00 at all levels.)

Lelira Cirim wrote:...I have difficulty talking for more than 1 solid hour. There are some syllabi I have noticed are growing large enough to be split from a huge 101 class to smaller 101/102/201 classes.

Actually, I'm thinking of making the standard class length 4 hours, with 101/102 combination classes lasting at least 8 hours. Because you just can't talk long enough about the intricacies of EVE Online.

Right?

Neville Smit wrote:

Lelira Cirim wrote:...I have difficulty talking for more than 1 solid hour. There are some syllabi I have noticed are growing large enough to be split from a huge 101 class to smaller 101/102/201 classes.

Actually, I'm thinking of making the standard class length 4 hours, with 101/102 combination classes lasting at least 8 hours. Because you just can't talk long enough about the intricacies of EVE Online.

Right?

Neville Smit wrote:Because you just can't talk long enough about the intricacies of EVE Online.
Right?

That will severely reduce the amount of time I can spend commenting on your blogs.

My Dscan 101 102 combination class has gone through a few iterations, but it tends to be between 60-90 minutes. That's a result of practice but also cutting out several advanced portions such as combat probing. It helps that the lecture portion can be dramatically slimmed down because basic dscan functions are simple to see. The applications are not, but once people get used to using it, they tend to ask a lot more questions about the applications.



Before, the class log would count people as attending class but only after 60 minutes. So that may have motivated teachers to spread out their class to 60-120 minutes. For teachers that take a long time to get started, I notice that they may not begin until 10-30 minutes have passed from when the class should have started.

Generally for convenience, I would post my links in my forum thread. Because I also reference that and my notes whenever I need to link things. Without them, if the lecture is 30-60 minutes long, I can easily forget things or do them out of order.

Neville Smit wrote:Actually, I'm thinking of making the standard class length 4 hours, with 101/102 combination classes lasting at least 8 hours. Because you just can't talk long enough about the intricacies of EVE Online.

Right?

I'm in.

Joking aside, length is irrelevant as long as the format is right. For the "information dump" classes, you don't want them to go on too long as people lose focus and interest after too much. As you know I'm a huge fan of the learn-by-doing school of thought and as long as you have people actively doing things during the class, it can go on for silly lengths of time and most people don't mind as they're actively involved and doing something.

As with most things, the practical components are the best things for getting someone to actually understand something if it's done in an engaging way. I've run a Dscan 101/102 class (based on my experiencing taking that class from Karimson at some point) and have to agree that it's massively more useful to actually make them do things and everyone comes away with a much better idea of what is actually going on.

That all being said - I realize not all classes fit that mould, just wanted to say that the length of the class isn't actually an issue most of the time; rather, that the length match the format for presentation. It has to be rewarding for the attendee, after all and if they aren't really paying attention, you've already lost.

Speaking as a pithy newcomer to E-Uni, from the student's perspective by far the two most memorable and useful classes I've attended were Karimson's D-scan 101 & 102 and Spanky's Art of War. The common element to both was a high level of interactivity that allowed us to instantly test and apply new knowledge.

In reference to long classes and videos, may I make a suggestion.

I have recently come across this answer on my end as a student, training through videos. (20 years of video watching and I never knew this .. Duhh)

In both media player and VLC there are options to speed up the playback of the video. This can be done without messing up the sound.

This will allow you to watch a long video in a shorter time frame and helps to keep you focused on what is being discussed.

I would suggest promoting this option along with the classes that are being offered.

I am sure there would be an audio version of this also for non video classes.

In other words:
To shorten the classes have the students speed up the playback.

Is there a place we can post "I am in need of or looking for this class: Fleet101" or such?

(I'm new at this so forgive me ... I'm not sure how the teachers match supply to demand.)

Qwer Stoneghost wrote:Is there a place we can post "I am in need of or looking for this class: Fleet101" or such?

(I'm new at this so forgive me ... I'm not sure how the teachers match supply to demand.)

http://forum.eveuniversity.org/viewtopi ... =72&t=3273 is the thread you're looking for.

Can we start paying our teachers? If we payed our teachers the typical reward for an L4 mission, they might teach a class instead of running an L4. I know this sounds very capitalistic...

When I see the word "Noob" I imediatly think of myself, and then follows "I can do this class! I can be successful", only to read that such classes as "Noob night in the Hole" coming up soon recommends an armor tanked Battlecruiser. LOLOLOL

I'm starting to understand that Noob actually means, "those players who are new to the university, but are space rich and have played the game for 10 years".

I suggest you think more carefully about the titles of these classes, as I can't even afford one Battlecruiser and thus am not going to attend this class.
New players may not read as much as I do, and therefore may also think that frigates are appropriate as they also can not afford anything else.
This post likely sounds more harsh than I intend it, and for that I apologize.