EVE University Forum

ALL HAIL THE AFTERBURNER/CLOAK TRICK.

So some time ago we got an update to T1 haulers.
The Badger,Nereus,Wreathe,Sigil all got Agility Bonuses and mass reduction.


So i played around with the Wreathe to find a good basic T1 hauler my trading alts could use.
Imagine my surprise when not only was the wreathe able to do the cloak trick but with an afterburner.

Wreathe Meta

Spoiler

[Wreathe, Wreathe hauler high sec T1]

Type-D Restrained Expanded Cargo
Type-D Restrained Inertial Stabilizers
Type-D Restrained Inertial Stabilizers
Type-D Restrained Inertial Stabilizers
Type-D Restrained Expanded Cargo

Medium F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Medium F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Compact Multispectrum Shield Hardener
10MN Y-S8 Compact Afterburner

Improved Cloaking Device II
[Empty High slot]

Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I

With the following skills it can align in 4.5 seconds and do the cloak trick.
Acceleration control 3
After Burner 4
Navigation 3
Evasive Maneuvering 3
Space ship command 3
Minmatar hauler 3

The only downside is obviously and alpha can't do it as it requires Cloaking 3

Going to T2 the align time is improved to 4.22 s and the margin for error reduced

Spoiler

[Wreathe, Wreathe hauler high sec]

Expanded Cargohold II
Expanded Cargohold II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II

Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Medium Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
10MN Afterburner II

Improved Cloaking Device II
[Empty High slot]

Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I

But what about the others ?.
Well in agility/mass/speed they all line up like this.


So judging by that the nereus can do it also.
and you would be correct.
With the help of my able assistant Ray Zolo we were able to test it with the above skills and it does also work.

Nereus

Spoiler

[Nereus, Nereus AB/Cloak]

Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Expanded Cargohold II
Expanded Cargohold II

10MN Afterburner II
Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
EM Shield Amplifier II
Thermal Shield Amplifier II

Improved Cloaking Device II
[Empty High slot]

Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I

4.5s align time seems to be the benchmark.

Now not having amarr hauler i could not test the Sigil but the badger with good skills can also do it.

Badger

Spoiler

[Badger, Badger AB/Cloak]

Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Expanded Cargohold II

10MN Afterburner II
Large Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
EM Shield Amplifier II
Thermal Shield Amplifier II

Improved Cloaking Device II
[Empty High slot]

Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I

Sigil

Spoiler

[Sigil, Sigil AB/Cloak]

Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Inertial Stabilizers II
Expanded Cargohold II
Expanded Cargohold II
Damage Control II

10MN Afterburner II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
EM Shield Amplifier II

Improved Cloaking Device II
[Empty High slot]

Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I
Medium Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer I

Sigil tested and working with the help of Void Delver.
Acceleration control 3
AfterBurner 4
Evasive Maneurvering 4
Navigation 5
Amarr hauler 1
Space ship Command 5

Now obviously when your skills improve the align time will improve.
My Wreathe currently aligns in 3.4s


So there you go.
I release you from the shackles of an MWD and no tank.
Fly Safe o7

Currently testing with an Epithal and are close.

I have been asking myself why I would do the Cloak trick with an Afterburner if I can do it in a MicroWarpDrive.

As a Newbro, with low skills, I find it hard to fit the MWD on a T1 Hauler because of the impact to PowerGrid. So depending on your skill level the MWD may not be an option until your skill level gets higher.

But even if I could fit an MWD there are additional benefits to the AB option:
-the AB option would allow me to fit a better tank, with higher EHP and Resists.
-also, the AB does not bloom the ship Signature, and thus increases the threshold (lock time) for the Tackling ship to acquire a lock on me in case my timing is off.

Please let me know what you think.

Awesome, and so creative! Thank you for researching and testing for us all

Alas, poor microwarpdrive/cloak trick! I knew it, Tal, a trick of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy. It hath bore me on its back a thousand times, and now how abhorr'd in my imagination it is!

Well, at least for my alt hauler.

Long live the Cloak/AB trick Great post...I knicked the Sigil fit!

Now this is very interesting. I've played on and off since 2005 and mwd+cloak is one of those things that has been around for so long that it's just one of those things that isn't questioned. I guess it really does help to real the patch notes sometimes.

Awesome find, I am going to have to mess around with this.

Hi unistas,

just a quick question from a newbie hauler. Is it possible to use the Afterburner/Cloack trick in an Epithal (hauler for PI) with an align time of 8.84s?

If I understand the trick correctly, applying it is dependent on align time. Or am I mistaken?

Thank you very much in advance.
Zuul Oom.

Hi,

reading an interesting Discord discussion on insta-lock, I have found this guide at https://english.eve-guides.fr/index.php?article=105 that I think explains very well the details of the why and how of the Cloak trick. In case a newbie like me wants to know more, the guide is a good document to start with.

Zuul Oom.

Zuul Oom wrote: ↑2023.02.08 11:18 Hi unistas,

just a quick question from a newbie hauler. Is it possible to use the Afterburner/Cloack trick in an Epithal (hauler for PI) with an align time of 8.84s?

If I understand the trick correctly, applying it is dependent on align time. Or am I mistaken?

Thank you very much in advance.
Zuul Oom.

Nope we tested and the only way you can do it is with an MWD.
It dosn't have the align bonuses like the T1 do so it is difficult without an MWD.

Thanks Tal Tracyn,

I will keep then my MWD.

Interesting idea & thread, thanks!

I experimented a bit, but couldn't get it to work on my T2-fitted Wreathe unless I heated the AB. There might have been balancing changes since mid-2022 of course.

Quick manual math... (is there a tool for this?)
* Ship needs to align reasonably fast to get to max. speed in one AB cycle, i.e. inertia modifier needs to be sufficiently low. In my case: Minmatar Hauler 3, Evasive Maneuvering 5, Spaceship Command 4, 3x Inertial Stabilizer II give 3.86s align.
* Ship needs 75% of max. speed + correct velocity vector to initiate warp
* Improved Cloaking Device II reduces speed to 25%.
* T2 AB gives 135% speed boost cold, or 135% * 1.5 = 202.5% hot
* Acceleration Control improves the speed boost by 5% per level

Putting it together, assuming Acceleration Control 5 for 25% AB speed boost:
Cold: (100% + 135% * 1.25) * 0.25 = 67.19 % of max speed. No bueno, we will need to accelerate after decloaking. In practice this should be 1 tick only, so probably no issue.
Hot: (100% + 135% * 1.5 * 1.25) * 0.25 = 88.28% of max speed. Warps after the decloak tick.

So I guess that explains why it didn't work for me without heat? If somebody has tried this recently, please share your experiences

I just used the AB + cloak trick with my Nereus. Works like a charm. I have 3.85s align time.