Curse

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Bob Maths

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Post 2017.05.11 12:22

Curse

I've been looking at some fits for the Curse although it's a bit blingy, the idea with this specific fit is to kite their targeting range whilst blapping them at brawling range although I guess a tracking disruptor with tracking speed and scan resolution dampeners can be equally as powerful especially if they still have range to engage you at 10km with 3 damps.

  Code:
[Curse, Curse you]
Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Corelum A-Type Energized Thermal Membrane
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Dark Blood Warp Scrambler
Khanid Navy Stasis Webifier
50MN Digital Booster Microwarpdrive

Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Prototype Cloaking Device I

Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II



'Augmented' Hammerhead x15

Caldari Navy Inferno Heavy Assault Missile in HAMs



  Code:
[Curse, Curse you]
Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Corelum A-Type Energized Thermal Membrane
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Tracking Disruptor II/Guidance Disruptor II
Dark Blood Warp Scrambler
Khanid Navy Stasis Webifier
50MN Digital Booster Microwarpdrive

Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Prototype Cloaking Device I

Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II



'Augmented' Hammerhead x15

Caldari Navy Inferno Heavy Assault Missile in HAMS




Also, for gang PVP where scrams and webs are already available, the obvious choice is neuting

  Code:
[Curse, *Curse you]
Corpum C-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Corpum C-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Corelum A-Type Energized Thermal Membrane
Corpum A-Type Energized EM Membrane

Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Shadow Serpentis Remote Sensor Dampener
Tracking Disruptor II
Guidance Disruptor II
Federation Navy 10MN Afterburner

Corpum C-Type Medium Energy Neutralizer
Corpum C-Type Medium Energy Neutralizer
Corpum B-Type Medium Energy Neutralizer
Corpum A-Type Medium Energy Nosferatu
Corpum A-Type Medium Energy Nosferatu

Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Anti-Kinetic Pump II



'Augmented' Hammerhead x15

Caldari Navy Inferno Heavy Assault Missile in HAMs
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Kerodan Alduin

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Post 2017.05.11 21:47

Re: Curse

I am not sure whether a HAM Curse is a thing we should feature on the Wiki. Surely, it is a very niche fit, which doesn't even make use of the Curse's inherent hull bonuses. And at >1.5 bil the fit you linked is a tad expensive for what it can do (212 dps HAMS, 261DPS drones, 18.8k tank at all V?). Just use a Sacrilege for a fraction of the price. Or a Rook as a missile/ewar recon. Or a blingy HAM Legion of you want to bling.

The same goes, in principe, for the neuting Curse.

I'd suggest making one armor and one shield fit for use with the respective fleet doctrines with tanks which can actually survive in a fleet situation and maybe a third solo fit. I am not sure though whether the Curse or the Pilgrim makes for the better solo hull - any suggestions?

[EDIT] The DPS I reported was the HAM DPS, drones not counted. Still, why HAMS and a BCU? Switching the BCU for a tech 2 DDA brings the drone DPS to 315.
Last edited by Kerodan Alduin on 2017.05.12 21:00, edited 2 times in total.
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Biwako Acami

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Post 2017.05.12 06:41

Re: Curse

It seems fairly unusual to fit a T2 hull without taking any benefit from the bonuses the hull provides. There are a few fits that sport launchers but generally just as trickle DPS with focus on neut over launchers.

Its already D-Scan immune so its best to make use of that strength when you need it. If you want a cloaky recon then you can switch to the Pilgrim that gets fitting cost reduction on cloak. If anything I see sensor boosters on Curses (for which I still have to understand the intention)
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Kerodan Alduin

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Post 2017.05.12 20:02

Re: Curse

Here are my three suggestions. The fleet fits need incoming cap from logi, or shift around neuts and NOSes until they are sufficiently cap stable. The armor fleet fit could work within an AHAC fleet; I am not sure whether the shield fit can get by with an AB - that probably depends on the fleet situation.

For solo work I prefer the Pilgrim to the Curse, but then again I live in a wormhole. In k-space I guess the Curse could work.

Add bling to taste.

  Code:
[Curse, Curse armor fleet]

Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Corelum C-Type Energized Thermal Membrane
1600mm Rolled Tungsten Compact Plates

10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Tracking Disruptor II
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier
Faint Epsilon Scoped Warp Scrambler
Tracking Disruptor II
Tracking Disruptor II

Medium Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer
Medium Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer
Medium Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II

Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Anti-EM Pump II


Hammerhead II x5
Valkyrie II x5
Acolyte II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5


  Code:
[Curse, Curse shield fleet]

Damage Control II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Capacitor Power Relay II

10MN Afterburner II
Large Shield Extender II
Pithum C-Type EM Ward Amplifier
Pithum C-Type Thermal Dissipation Amplifier
Large Shield Extender II
Tracking Disruptor II

Medium Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer
Medium Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer
Medium Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender II


Hammerhead II x5
Valkyrie II x5
Acolyte II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5


  Code:
[Curse, Curse solo]

Drone Damage Amplifier II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
1600mm Steel Plates II

10MN Y-S8 Compact Afterburner
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier
J5 Enduring Warp Disruptor
Tracking Disruptor II
Tracking Disruptor II
Medium Cap Battery II

Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Nosferatu II

Medium Anti-Thermal Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II


Hammerhead II x5
Valkyrie II x5
Acolyte II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5


Comments and suggestions are welcome.
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Budda Sereda

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Post 2017.05.12 21:36

Re: Curse

Kerodan Alduin wrote:I am not sure whether a HAM Curse is a thing we should feature on the Wiki. Surely, it is a very niche fit, which doesn't even make use of the Curse's inherent hull bonuses. And at >1.5 bil the fit you linked is a tad expensive for what it can do (212 dps HAMS, 261DPS drones, 18.8k tank at all V?). Just use a Sacrilege for a fraction of the price. Or a Rook as a missile/ewar recon. Or a blingy HAM Legion of you want to bling.

The same goes, in principe, for the neuting Curse.

I agree with a concern about non-typical fits. Same about 1.5B BLing fit: those are not something teaching organization should publish at Wiki as a reference. Unless non-typical fit ROCKS, justify in this case please.

Kerodan Alduin wrote:I'd suggest making one armor and one shield fit for use with the respective fleet doctrines with tanks which can actually survive in a fleet situation and maybe a third solo fit.

Agree! Though, see:
Biwako wrote:It seems fairly unusual to fit a T2 hull without taking any benefit from the bonuses the hull provides.

Why you concerned about neuting Curse? And if not using Neuts, maybe other empire's T2 ships would work better?
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Kerodan Alduin

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Post 2017.05.13 08:00

Re: Curse

I was concerned about the extremely expensive neuting Curse in the first post, not about neuting Curses in general. A Curse is made for neuting, after all. The fits I linked serve that purpose, but consider them to be a starting point rather than fully fleshed out fits.
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Bob Maths

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Post 2017.05.13 10:53

Re: Curse

Biwako Acami wrote:It seems fairly unusual to fit a T2 hull without taking any benefit from the bonuses the hull provides. There are a few fits that sport launchers but generally just as trickle DPS with focus on neut over launchers.

Its already D-Scan immune so its best to make use of that strength when you need it. If you want a cloaky recon then you can switch to the Pilgrim that gets fitting cost reduction on cloak. If anything I see sensor boosters on Curses (for which I still have to understand the intention)


You mean sensor dampeners? It's more a 'direct denial' fit aimed to prevent almost all of the incoming damage whilst maintaining the illusion of being able to hit back. Unless you're talking about other fits, I imagine the boosters are for targeting time reductions. In terms of application, it may not matter much with the BCU being changed for a plate for better long term survival against drones and switching HAMs to Rapid Lights.

The cloak is tandem with the d-scan immunity, it can idle on a grid in relic site or whatever and emerge whilst someone is hacking or something like a poco, admittedly you would have to be quick when warping on grid to a combat site to cloak up.

If you want to cheap up the neuts/noses you may as well use C-types.
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Biwako Acami

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Post 2017.05.15 02:07

Re: Curse

My comment on bonuses were about not having energy weapons on the best energy weapon ship (by bonuses) of its class. Lachesis is a better Sensor Dampening recon ship for that purpose and has better mid slot layout an additional mid slot for that support role.

The cloak is situational and I think the applications are too niche to be part of a wiki fit. I like the idea of sneaking into a site and sitting cloaked for a target but I'm not sure that's a popular use case.

Current Wiki fits are:
SPOILER WARNING!
  Code:
[Curse, Cap Warfare]
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I
Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I

50MN Cold-Gas Enduring Microwarpdrive
Large Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
EM Ward Field II
Thermal Dissipation Field II
Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I

Damage Control II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II


Hammerhead II x5
Hammerhead II x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5

Tracking Speed Disruption Script x1


  Code:
[Curse, Cap Warfare Active Shield]
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I
Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I

50MN Cold-Gas Enduring Microwarpdrive
Large Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Small Capacitor Booster II
Medium Ancillary Shield Booster
Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I

Damage Control II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I


Hammerhead II x5
Hammerhead II x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5

Cap Booster 50 x1
Tracking Speed Disruption Script x1


  Code:
[Curse, E-UNI Curse - Standard]
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Improved Cloaking Device II

Medium Capacitor Booster II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
EM Ward Field II
Balmer Series Compact Tracking Disruptor I
50MN Cold-Gas Enduring Microwarpdrive

Power Diagnostic System II
Power Diagnostic System II
Power Diagnostic System II
Damage Control II

Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I


Valkyrie II x5
Warrior II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Hammerhead II x5

Navy Cap Booster 400 x28
Optimal Range Disruption Script x1
Tracking Speed Disruption Script x1

After looking at zkillboard it looks like the most popular fits generally follow:
  • at least 3 medium neuts
  • almost always shield tanked
  • may have one tracking disruptor
  • occassionally uses oversized AB to reduce signature bloom
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White 0rchid

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Post 2017.05.15 11:18

Re: Curse

What is even going on here. A few things (now I'm back from my week of holiday):

  • Don't fit gun/missile weapon systems to a ship that requires its high slots to actually be useful. Otherwise you may as well just take a T1 cruiser and fit it for all out damage
  • Don't ram in damps for the sake of it on a ship that isn't bonused to them
  • Don't fit cloaks on combat recons (unless you know what you're doing)
  • Don't bother fitting buffer rigs unless you actually have a buffer mod fitted (plate/extender). Rigs add percentage, mods add raw (with a few exceptions), therefore the gains are minimal from just fitting rigs. Actually, in general there aren't many fleet ships that can survive on resists alone. Fit more buffer
  • HAMs are one of the worst weapon systems in the game.
  • Curses/Pilgrims have very, very niche uses. Most, if not all of those uses, involve relying on their neut power, even more so for the Curse since is has twice the bonuses that the Pilgrim does.

Now I'm not saying these are the only fits you could have for a Curse, but they certainly cover a lot of situations.

Solo Curses come in 2 main forms, buffer:

SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Solo Shield Buffer Curse]

Damage Control II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

EM Ward Field II
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Warp Disruptor II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
50MN Cold-Gas Enduring Microwarpdrive

Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer

Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Ancillary Current Router I


Hammerhead II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Hammerhead II x5


Or a self rep:

SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Solo Shield Rep Curse]

Damage Control II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Power Diagnostic System II

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Republic Fleet Large Cap Battery
Warp Disruptor II
50MN Quad LiF Restrained Microwarpdrive

Small Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Small Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Processor Overclocking Unit II


Hammerhead II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Infiltrator II x5


Fleet fits are kinda meh, because really, there's not a huge amount of use for fleet curses, not in big fleets anyway, and in small gang you'd just use the solo fit. I don't really like these but if you must.... (shield is better by far)

Fleet (Armor)

SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Fleet Armor AB]

1600mm Steel Plates II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Corpii A-Type Thermal Plating
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II

10MN Afterburner II
Tracking Disruptor II
Tracking Disruptor II
Small Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400
Guidance Disruptor II
Warp Disruptor II

Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Small Energy Nosferatu II
Small Energy Nosferatu II

Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II


Hammerhead II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Infiltrator II x5


Fleet (Shield)

SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Fleet Shield MWD]

Damage Control II
Power Diagnostic System II
Power Diagnostic System II
Power Diagnostic System II

50MN Quad LiF Restrained Microwarpdrive
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
EM Ward Field II
Thermal Dissipation Field II

Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu

Medium Core Defense Field Extender II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender II


Hammerhead II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Infiltrator II x5
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Eshod

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Post 2017.05.20 01:01

Re: Curse

White 0rchid wrote:
  • Don't fit gun/missile weapon systems to a ship that requires its high slots to actually be useful. Otherwise you may as well just take a T1 cruiser and fit it for all out damage
  • Don't ram in damps for the sake of it on a ship that isn't bonused to them
  • Don't fit cloaks on combat recons (unless you know what you're doing)
  • Don't bother fitting buffer rigs unless you actually have a buffer mod fitted (plate/extender). Rigs add percentage, mods add raw (with a few exceptions), therefore the gains are minimal from just fitting rigs. Actually, in general there aren't many fleet ships that can survive on resists alone. Fit more buffer
  • HAMs are one of the worst weapon systems in the game.
  • Curses/Pilgrims have very, very niche uses. Most, if not all of those uses, involve relying on their neut power, even more so for the Curse since is has twice the bonuses that the Pilgrim does.

Now I'm not saying these are the only fits you could have for a Curse, but they certainly cover a lot of situations.

Solo Curses come in 2 main forms, buffer:

SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Solo Shield Buffer Curse]

Damage Control II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

EM Ward Field II
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Warp Disruptor II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
50MN Cold-Gas Enduring Microwarpdrive

Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer

Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Ancillary Current Router I


Hammerhead II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Hammerhead II x5


Or a self rep:

SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Solo Shield Rep Curse]

Damage Control II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Power Diagnostic System II

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Republic Fleet Large Cap Battery
Warp Disruptor II
50MN Quad LiF Restrained Microwarpdrive

Small Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Medium Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu
Medium Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Small Ghoul Compact Energy Nosferatu

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Processor Overclocking Unit II


Hammerhead II x5
Hornet EC-300 x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Infiltrator II x5



Concur with the above. Although niche fits can work for certain situations, you are taking a highly situational ship and making the solo viability even more narrow than necessary.

If the goal is to provide min/maxed simplistic ship fittings that can be used in a flexible situation, the two above fits are the starting point for the Curse.
"Without training, they lacked knowledge. Without knowledge, they lacked confidence. Without confidence, they lacked victory." - Julius Ceasar
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Bob Maths

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Post 2017.06.09 14:24

Re: Curse

I think for a pure support role this may be reasonable

SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Curse you]

Reactor Control Unit II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II

Remote Sensor Dampener II
Remote Sensor Dampener II
50MN Y-T8 Compact Microwarpdrive
Target Painter II
Tracking Disruptor II
C-IR Compact Guidance Disruptor

Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Nosferatu II
Medium Energy Nosferatu II

Medium Anti-Thermal Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II


Hammerhead II x5


Optimal Range Disruption Script x1
Tracking Speed Disruption Script x1
Scan Resolution Dampening Script x1
Targeting Range Dampening Script x1
Missile Range Disruption Script x1
Missile Precision Disruption Script x1
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Mrakling

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Post 2017.06.09 18:09

Re: Curse

I think it's far from reasonable. Here's why:

You wasted a low slot for a fitting module which literally doesn't do much more than swapping one T2 Neut/Nos for a compact one would. You also have a shit tank with mediocre speed - although you have the resists to get good reps, you don't have the buffer to survive for 5 seconds if you're being primaried - which is crucial when armor tanking (armor reps land at the end of their cycle?!). Your mids are also a complete mess. Why use 2x damps instead of just using the Ewar your hull is bonused for? You literally have a swiss army knife that can't excel at any of the roles it has been given. You're also using a compact MGD for absolutely no reason.

Unless I am wrong, the idea of this forum was to evaluate hulls based on their strength and try to build fits around said strengths - and not try to make every hull do every job in the game.
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Budda Sereda

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Post 2017.07.09 00:57

Re: Curse

Published both Solo and Fleet Armor version from White. Converted his Shield Fleet fit into Oversized AB fit (looks sexy :), with notes on how to make it MWD. Please tell me if that's stupid.

For Armor I posted fits recommended in WHC:
SPOILER WARNING!
[Curse, Armor Fleet Logies support]

Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
800mm Steel Plates II

Remote Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script
Remote Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script
Remote Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script
Ship Scanner II
Sensor Booster II, ECCM Script
10MN Afterburner II

Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II

Medium Ancillary Current Router II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II


Vespa EC-600 x10
Hammerhead II x5


Targeting Range Script x4
Scan Resolution Script x1
ECCM Script x3

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