New Incursion Runners Resources

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Phaithless

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Post 2017.02.25 23:59

New Incursion Runners Resources

Credit goes to Kataki Soikutsu for the original posting of this. I have just endeavored to take it over to fix dead links and put in any new information as the original post is no longer being updated. I have attempted to keep as much of his original text and post as authentic as possible while still updating any pertinent information.

What is an Incursion?
Incursions are group PvE content. They require specialized roles and relativley high skilled ships. It is about 60 days of training from a new character. Though almost all skills needed are basic ship sport skills that most characters train anyway. Because of the higher requirements Incursions pay well. Plus there is a big social aspect as a fleet is required, unlike missions. The EVE University Wiki has a number excellent articles on Incursions if you would like more details about them.

How can I participate?
The first step is to join our in game chat channel, Incursions.E-UNI, and mailing list, Incursions.E-UNI. We also have our very own Slack Channel.

Next you need to assemble a ship to fly with us. The on grid roles are usually done with Battleships and Tech 2 Logistics ships, with an occasional Strategic Cruiser or Command Ship. Incursions require high skill ships because they are end game content and anything less is a danger to one's self and your fleet. Interested pilots who cannot fly these ships yet can still join us in support roles. We always need Scout/Hackers and Pickets. These roles do not require high levels of skills and get you into a fleet to get a feel for how we run. A summary of all of our Roles.

Interested pilots should also read over the following pages to prepare for Incursions:
Preparing for Incursions
Incursion Checklist
Ship fittings
EVE University Vanguard Fits (11 Pilot fleets)
EVE University Assault Fits (15-20 Pilot fleets)
EVE University Headquarters Fits (35-40 Pilot fleets). Due to the nature and difficult of HQ fits and the fluidity of membership in the Uni, we do not attempt HQs very often. However, if you are interested in the fits, The Valhalla Project is a very good place to look.
Safe movement between Incursion constellations during War !!!EXTREMELY IMPORTANT FOR UNISTAS!!!

In addition EVE University runs Incursion 101 classes which are great sources of information. Please watch the Scheduled Classes Forum for when this class will be taught next.


Going Deeper:
Here we have some more recent updates from Cassiel Seraphim with regards to some of the more recent changes.
A more in depth look at the numbers behind what we do, for those of you who like to theorycraft. Examine the Anatomoy of Incursions after you've been in a couple of fleets and you are interested in the 'why' of what an FC tells you.
A look at Ship Progression in Eve University Incursions.


Other Information:
The UNI Incursion Community also runs in Solitude when an Incursion spawns there.

Pilots interested in training alts to fill other Incursion roles should check out the following forum threads:
30 day Orca Alt - Designed to be dual account trained with one PLEX. This alt will be able to fly an Orca with a solid tank. In addition this all will be able to ferry a pirate BS of your choice between Incursions. Really a must for Unistas at war.

FAQ:
Why are there no T1 Amarr hulls on the Wiki?
Unfortunately, none of the T1 Amarr BSs can be shield tanked for Incursions. We require 70% resists, 10k base shield HP, 10 minutes of cap, a Sensor Booster, and a Federation Navy Stasis Webbifier for all battleships. A combination of low base shield HP, a weak capacitor, and only 4 mid slots means the T1 Amarr hulls cannot meet this minimum without severely gimping their damage capabilities.

For Amarr pilots, we recommend that you start in a Rokh. This is because the end game ship most Amarr pilots use is the Nightmare, which requires both Caldari and Amarr Battleship skills to fly. If a pilot gets Caldari Battleship IV and Large Hybrid Turret IV in the Rokh, only about 5 days of training are "wasted" when the pilot shifts to a Nightmare. While there are Navy Amarr ships on the wiki, we advise against them. They are quite pricy and frankly not as good or flexible as any of the T1 options on the wiki. It is better to save the ISK for an upgrade to a Nightmare in the future. The other option is to bring a Legion, but this requires a longer skill train than the Rokh, so is not the suggested path.

Why are there no Missile hulls on the Wiki?

Missiles and Guns work fundamentally differently in EVE. The best way to understand the relevant difference is to imagine you are in a Battleship with large weapons. If you and your target are stationary, then guns will deal full damage no matter the size of the target. While the damage a missile does depends on the ratio of the target's signature to the explosion radius of the missile. Hence a big gun can deal a lot of damage to a small target, but a big missile cannot. In Vanguard Incursion sites, most of the NPCs are frigates. As we bring a lot of webs, they are moving close enough to stopped to deal full damage with guns. But Torpeadoes and Cruise Missiles would maybe deal 1/3 to 1/2 of their damage, if you have really good skills and have the spare mid slots for target painters. This asymetry between how guns and missiles work on small targets, even under optimal conditions, is the reason missiles are not used by the UNI in Incursions.

The caveat is Assault and Headquarters fleets will take missile ships. There are more large targets, so this signature radius issue does not crop up as much. If the UNI is currently doing a larger fleet, missile hulls are acceptable. If you have any questions on fits, please ask here in the forum or in the in game chat channel.
Last edited by Phaithless on 2017.02.27 00:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Tansarii Kashada

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Post 2017.02.26 04:39

Re: New Incursion Runners Resources

Good stuff!
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Phaithless

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Post 2017.02.26 18:56

Re: New Incursion Runners Resources

One of these days I'll need to figure out how to put in my paltry medals and a signature
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Ian Tucenghi

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Post 2017.02.27 04:07

Re: New Incursion Runners Resources

Great Job! Thank you, Phaithless! :)
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Matt Mustang

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Post 2017.03.01 02:22

Re: New Incursion Runners Resources

Phaithless wrote: It is about 60 days of training from a new character.


I loled a bit when I saw this part. 6 week vindi pilot FTW (for the win, dirty minded scrubs).
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Rikki Bigg

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Post 2017.03.02 03:55

Re: New Incursion Runners Resources

I would change the bit up about headquarter fits.

While the community you listed has EVE University alumni floating around in it, the fits that headquarter fleets use are not a good comparison to E-Uni fits.

Our fits are based upon teaching and safety, while HQ fits from most public communities are based on efficiency. We do not actively discourage efficiency, but it is several notches down the list on importance. Similar to how we don't have pirate hull fits, preferring pilots to know the principles of why and how fitting is calculated; HQ fits might be referenced from the perspective of the steeper influence penalties or other mechanics that won't be seen in vanguards, such as dealing with energy neutralizers.
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Kejane

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Post 2017.03.05 18:49

Re: New Incursion Runners Resources

I've read through the post and I feel like some of the points from the original post could use updating. Would love to hear your feedback about these:

Why are there no T1 Amarr hulls on the Wiki?
While there are Navy Amarr ships on the wiki, we advise against them. They are quite pricy and frankly not as good or flexible as any of the T1 options on the wiki. It is better to save the ISK for an upgrade to a Nightmare in the future.

The Navy ships are more expensive than the Nightmare at this point, plus they're not even on the wiki any longer. Also, corrected the numbers a little bit, boring details:
SPOILER WARNING!
Assuming minimal skill requirements and a +\- average SP/H rate (~2130). 5 days is too much for training from zero to level III, and way optimistic for level IV (even 3->4 is 7.5 days, and that's on remap, with +5 implants). That is to say, if someone wants to upgrade to a Nightmare, I'd argue getting Caldari BS4 and Large Hybrids 4 isn't very useful in the first place; and if they stay in a Rokh, no training is useless and this paragraph doesn't apply to them.

Suggested edit:
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For Amarr pilots, we recommend that you start in a [b]Rokh[/b]. This is because the end game ship most Amarr pilots use is the [b]Nightmare[/b], which requires both Caldari and Amarr Battleship skills to fly. If a pilot gets [b]Caldari Battleship III[/b] and [b]Large Hybrid Turret III[/b] for the [b]Rokh[/b], only about 3 days of training are "wasted" when the pilot shifts to a [b]Nightmare[/b] (assuming they didn't have any hybrid turret skills already trained). While some Navy Issue Amarr ships can be made to work, we advise against them. Nowadays, they are more expensive than the much more capable [b]Nightmare[/b], and frankly not even as good or flexible as any of the T1 options on the wiki. The other option is to bring a Legion, but this requires a longer skill train than the [b]Rokh[/b], so is not the suggested path.


Why are there no Missile hulls on the Wiki?

A nice summary, but I'd also mention that missiles are delayed damage, which is also an important point. I was thinking to add a point about "public HQ vs missiles" (spots are sometimes available, but as a temporary measure while cross-training into turrets), but that is probably not needed there.

Suggested edit:
  Code:
[url=http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Missile_damage]Missiles[/url] and [url=http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Turret_damage]Guns[/url] work fundamentally differently in EVE. The best way to understand the relevant difference is to imagine you are in a Battleship with large weapons. If you and your target are stationary, then guns will deal full damage no matter the size of the target. While the damage a missile does [u]depends on the ratio[/u] of the target's signature to the explosion radius of the missile. Hence a big gun can deal a lot of damage to a small target, but a big missile cannot. In Vanguard Incursion sites, most of the NPCs are frigates. As we bring a lot of webs, they are moving at speeds close enough to "stopped" to deal full damage with guns. But Torpedoes and Cruise Missiles would maybe deal 1/3 to 1/2 of their damage, if you have really good skills and have the spare mid slots for target painters. This asymetry between how guns and missiles work on small targets, even under optimal conditions, is the main reason missiles are not used by the UNI in Incursions.

The second big reason is the travel time. While turret-based weapon systems apply their damage instantly, a Cruise Missile would take anywhere between 2 and 6 seconds to reach its target. Meanwhile, the rest of the fleet might unload a volley (some ships — possibly twice), destroying the target before the missiles reach it, which effectively wastes the entire salvo. In comparison, if a gunboat attempts to fire at something that has been destroyed the very same moment, nothing will happen and they will be free to shoot again immediately. Firing at the fleet's next target (e.g. at a battleship tagged "D", while everyone else is still firing at battleship "C") is a way to partially circumvent this problem, but even then, some issues remain.

The caveat is Assault and Headquarters fleets will sometimes take missile ships. There are more large targets, so the signature radius issue does not crop up as much, however, turret-based weaponry is still better suited for the purpose. If the UNI is currently doing a larger fleet, missile hulls are acceptable. If you have any questions on fits, please ask here in the forum or in the in game chat channel.


Going Deeper:
Examine the Anatomoy of Incursions after you've been

A small typo, and not a big deal, but still. ^^

Speaking of typos, please consider proof-reading the edits. I wouldn't call my English horrible, but sometimes Russian punctuation bleeds through, along with a merry band of typos.

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