[AAR] Golden Horde 2018.04.30 - The Horde Cometh

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Harai Rex
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Title: Lieutenant Junior Grade, Sophomore

[AAR] Golden Horde 2018.04.30 - The Horde Cometh

Post by Harai Rex »

Hey all! Sorry for the delay on this AAR; I intended to get it up by Tuesday at the latest, but a history essay swooped in and ate up all my free time. This fleet was action-packed, with tons o' content and tons o' kills. A lot of these kills kinda blur together in my memory because they happened so fast (I should start recording my fleets), so many of the fight descriptions will probably boil down to "scouts did good work, tackled content, we came and blapped it quick." If you remember a particular fight better than how I describe it here, feel free to add to the AAR in a reply!
Spoiler
Analiese Aubernet - Scout
Bethany Cartharsis - Vanguard
Christoph Patrouette
Coaxster - Vanguard
Derby Dank
Gemma Solett - Scout
HJ Schraff - Scout
Hank Asanari - Vanguard
Harai Rex - Herder of Cats (FC)
Jehoshaphat Ambraelle - Vanguard
Kontxesi Buchanan
Marn Vermuldir
Mols Halleck
Rohan Amadeus
Sagittarius Griffins
Satoshi Tomeii - 3IC
Staberinde - 2IC
Wokum
Xafen Katapi
The fleet undocked a little after 01:30. We had some very experienced pilots scouting for us, so I mostly just turned them loose and told them to go find us content. The rest of our comp was decent: I was a bit disappointed we had no logi, and also felt the fleet was a bit smaller than ideal, but we had a good balance of scrams and webs on the DD punishers and plenty of experienced pilots to make use of them. As it turned out, the fleet was plenty large enough for what we got into that night, and the scouts performed even better than I expected.

We found our first bit of content within 10 minutes of undocking. One of our scouts (Gemma, I believe?) found a lone Caracal in a plex in Ostingele. The scout established tackle, and the rest of us all piled in trying to melt the Caracal before our scout died. Another scout quickly established secondary point, allowing the first to warp off, and before long the rest of the fleet was on the Caracal and blapped it before those nasty RLMLs could do any more damage.

Caracal +32.78m

It wasn't too long after the Caracal kill that our scouts reported another bit of tasty content: Someone had found and tackled a Retribution in Agoze. Knowing full well that a Retribution can go ludicrously fast if left uncontrolled, I ordered the scouts to go for scram passes while rushing the rest of the fleet in to establish permanent scram ASAP. The scouts did their job well, and we were able to lock down and blow up the Retribution with fairly little difficulty.

Retribution +62.49m
Capsule +0.01m

Things quieted down for a bit as we made our merry way up towards Black Rise. While the fleet was in Vlillirier, Analiese reported a Hurricane in a large in Alsavoinon, one jump over. I raced the fleet over as Analiese established tackle, once again calling for scram passes from the scouts to shut down any MWD/MJD shenanigans. Once again, the scouts flew well, the fleet piled in, and the target was dead before they could do anything about it. Shortly after the Hurricane went down, someone found a plucky little Algos plexing elsewhere in the system. We went and killed him too.

Hurricane +76.84m
Algos +3.77m
Capsule +0.01m

"Corpse Snatching V"
- Sagittarius Griffins, showing off one of the rare and valuable pvp skills he has trained into

As we wrapped up in Alsavoinon, one of our scouts found a Cormorant in Vlillirier. The scout tackled, fleet piled in, and the Cormorant went down, leaving behind a killmail that showed off quite an ... interesting Corm fit.

Cormorant +24.42m

As we prepared to jump into Nennamaila from Aldranette, we received a rare treat: a lone Lachesis, landing on the other side of the gate. Taking advantage of the tankiness of golden horde punishers (i.e. they can absorb a few shots from gate guns), I ordered the fleet to spread out on the Aldranette side of the gate and prepare to catch him. He successfully crashed gate back to Nennamaila the first time, but some vanguard on the other side caught him again. Bizarrely, the Lachesis agressed while crashing gate, leaving himself trapped and allowing the rest of the fleet to come on in and join the party, losing only 1 pilot to gate guns. We also managed to catch the pod, which turned out to contain some VERY tasty snakes. My personal theory at the time was that the Lachesis agressed out of panic. However, looking at the killmail now, both the ship and the pod were clearly fitted for solo and, moreover, fitted well. I'm guessing the Lachesis pilot just plain underestimated us, and thought he could successfully kill the tackle or tank the damage. Heh, his loss.

Atron -0.79m
Lachesis +298.43m
Capsule +879.51m

After basking in the glorious explosion of the Lachesis and its pod, somebody found a tasty Comet. Scouts went in, tackle was established, fleet went in, Comet was erased.

Federation Navy Comet +30.84m

While we killed the Comet in Nennamaila, HJ got point on a Thrasher in Akidagi. I remember this one because, after establishing a solid orbit to hold point, HJ went AFK for a smoke break while waiting for the fleet to get to him. Bonus points to HJ for the only AFK kill of the fleet.

Thrasher +22.51m

Scout: "FC the battleships are warping to the Large Outpost."
FC: "Hmm I don't know if we can take this, it could be..."
Kontxesi: "Do it"
FC: "FLEET WARP WARP WARP TO THE BROADCASTED LARGE!"

- A scout, Harai Rex, and Kontxesi Buchanan, demonstrating the standard decision-making process of a Harai fleet

"It's not a Harai fleet if we don't welp."
- Gemma Solett, being right, but not in the way he thought

After killing the Thrasher, we moved on into Hikkoken, and what followed was, in my opinion, the highlight of the fleet. As our scouts and the first parts of our fleet landed on the Pynekastoh gate, a Maelstrom and an Armageddon landed on the gate right before us. The two battleships turned around and warped to a large outpost, clearly challenging us. I sent in a scout to check what range they were at; they had warped at 0! After the previously mentioned decision making process, I warped the fleet in, landing right on top of the two battleships. Fearing heavy neuts, I called primary on the Armageddon first. The battleships were clearly not fit for fighting frigates, let alone frigates as good at hunting larger ships as Golden Horde Punishers. The Maelstrom's autocannons couldn't track us whatsoever, and the rapid heavies of the Armageddon couldn't apply at all. The only incoming dps were the unbonused light drones they deployed to fight us. On top of that, the Armageddon did a terrible job bait tanking, not starting reps until he was already leaking hull, and only surviving a minute or so after that. The Mael tanked slightly better, but only outlived the charges on its XLASB by a few seconds. This was the perfect engagement for this doctrine, and, even more impressive, we killed both battleships without taking any losses.

Armageddon +309.11m
Maelstrom +415.63m
Capsule +6.42m
Capsule +0.01m

After killing the Battleships, we took a 5 minute bio break. Upon coming back from that, we started heading in the direction of Tama. Someone caught a Jaguar in Pynekastoh. Tackle was established, the fleet was brought in, and the Jag didn't live much longer after that.

Jaguar +66.24m

After killing the Jaguar, we chased a Stabber around system for a bit, before finally catching it at a planet. He didn't live long either.

Stabber +38.19m
Capsule +0.01m

"What if we try to welp to end fleet but keep accidentally killing stuff?'"
- Gemma Solett, accurately describing the last hour of the fleet

As we moved on from Pynekastoh, we caught a Maller on the gate in Rakpas. Something something tackle something something dead Maller.

Maller +44.3m

We found a couple Thrashers doing ... something at an asteroid belt in Reitsato. More sacrifices to whichever dark and demented counterpart to Bob rules lowsec. If he's the avatar of lowsec, he's probably some clearly malnourished homeless dude who refuses to drop his shiv and will stab you just to watch you die.

Thrasher +16.31m
Thrasher +16.31m

"We're in tama so of course we die now."
- Coaxster, being right

It was in Tama that this fleet finally met its end. We warped around the system, skirmishing with locals and playing with their bait. Right after the fleet warped away from a novice, a scout called tackle on something outside the novice. I rushed to turn the fleet around and get them back to the novice. As we landed, more and more neutrals landed constantly. I called a Sleipnir at 0 primary first. That didn't work out, and we came nowhere near breaking its tank. I eventually switched primary to a nearby Caracal and we started working on it. This entire time, more and more hostiles kept warping in, killing our punishers faster and faster. I was desperate to kill the Caracal, and called scatter far too late. The Caracal did finally die, but so did most of our fleet. After that fight, there were only 3 people still in ships who wanted to continue, so I called the fleet finished.

Kestrel +0.69m
Executioner -17.38m
Coercer +19.22m
Punisher +19.24m
Punisher -18.29m
Punisher -10.6m
Punisher -9.32m
Maulus -9.39m
Punisher -6.51m
Capsule +0.01m
Punisher -12.67m
Punisher -15.52m
Caracal +31.11m
Punisher -10.1m
Punisher -6m
Capsule -0.01m
Capsule -0.01m

Stats
ISK Destroyed: 2,414,413,144.83
ISK Lost: 116,581,010.74
ISK Delta: 2,297,832,134.09
Efficiency: 95.394%

This fleet was a massive success. More so, I think this fleet was a perfect demonstration of the strengths and weaknesses of the Golden Horde Punisher doctrine. We excelled at bringing down bigger targets, such as cruisers, battlecruisers, and battleships: our tankiness made us hard to kill, the MWD helped us get in range quickly, and the blasters allowed us to punch far harder than frigates normally can when we were right on top of the target. The Punisher's tankiness also allowed us to safely engage non-flashy targets on gates, which netted us kills, such as the Lachesis, that we otherwise wouldn't have gotten. The fight against the two battleships was the perfect showcase of this doctrine: scouts got us in at 0, we were too small and too close for the BS to do anything, and we did far more dps than they expected from a mid-size frigate fleet. Killing 2 battleships with 0 friendly losses is undoubtedly the highlight of my FC career so far. On top of all this, the scouts did a fantastic job, coordinating among themselves, finding huge amounts of content, and letting almost nothing slip away.

The welp at the end of the fleet is something I want to dissect. I said that this fleet demonstrated both the strengths and weaknesses of the Golden Horde Punisher; this fleet fight encapsulates all of its weaknesses. Golden Horde Punishers are very slow and struggle to apply outside point-blank range. This makes them borderline useless in a fleet fight, as it takes forever for them to start applying to the primary target, and most things we run into can simply outrun is. The weakness of the doctrine in fleet fights was compounded by some mistakes I made in FCing the fight. The simple fact of the matter is I was completely overwhelmed by this fight. It was late for me and I was tired, and then I was caught completely off guard when the scout called tackle at the novice. I didn't expect a fleet fight when we got there, and more and more hostiles kept warping in as the fight went on. I was overwhelmed by all the information I needed to process and how rapidly the tactical situation was changing. My second major mistake was insisting on walking away from this fight with a kill. I knew I was not up for this fight from pretty much the second it started, but I was bloodthirsty and insisted on sticking around until we killed at least one ship. If I had called scatter near the beginning of the fight, as my better judgement would've had me do, the majority of the fleet probably would've survived. Even worse, I went silent about halfway through the fight, something an FC should never do in a fight. The truth is, if it wasn't for Coaxster reminding me I only had a handful of ships left on grid, I probably would've commanded the entire fleet to their deaths.

This is not the first time I've struggled with FCing in a fleet fight. It is far and away my weakest skill as an FC, and it is something I plan to work on aggressively in future fleets. I need to learn to temper my urge to blow stuff up no matter what with a more objective assessment of how well the fleet can perform in this fight. I need to FC first, and pilot second, as opposed to the other way around.

Thank you to everyone who flew with me on this fleet, but a special thanks to our scouts for their outstanding work. As always please give your own thoughts and opinions on this fleet (and my performance) in the replies below. See you all around!

Happy hunting o7
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Gemma Solett
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Re: [AAR] Golden Horde 2018.04.30 - The Horde Cometh

Post by Gemma Solett »

Some great scouting by Analiese and HJ, and you were performing well too. That solo knowledge you have is definitely showing it's worth.
Your last point seems to be something that will mostly come down to practice, and practice in eve involves dying over and over and over...

Hopefully for your next fleet I'll be back up and fully operational again, looking forward to it :)
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Xafen Katapi
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Re: [AAR] Golden Horde 2018.04.30 - The Horde Cometh

Post by Xafen Katapi »

So the last fight (I was the one behind by a second that got tackle on the punisher and...):
The punisher, Juan Car1os, was there with a couple ships on the novice when we first came in (there were probably 3 when we first landed?). They all warped off quick so the fleet warped away to find more content (to a gate iirc). I was a bit slow to warp out and as I was aligning saw just the punisher warping back in. I smashed clt+space and, as he was warping in to 0, I easily got the tackle. I called the tackle, spammed "needs backup" and you all came to my aid!

As you all were in warp I saw a few more ships popping up on short D...welp...it was a good night. Comms were busy at that point and you all were just landing with FC starting to make calls so I kept more quiet than I probably should have seeing the extra ships coming in. You all landed and within a couple seconds the opposing fleet had also landed. They did quite an excellent job baiting our tired, past-bedtime fleet I must say!

I think after the crazy night of near constant action we were just in a spam F1 see what happens bleary-eyed mood without much thought processing going on at the end there. I'd say we were pretty giddy and wern't too concerned with doing everything right at the end there. Like you mentioned, those last several systems we were in were pretty much, welp, let's see what happens and get home already! We pretty much were looking for and end like that lol...

The fleet was awesome, and I hope we have many more like it!
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Harai Rex
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Re: [AAR] Golden Horde 2018.04.30 - The Horde Cometh

Post by Harai Rex »

Xafen Katapi wrote: Comms were busy at that point and you all were just landing with FC starting to make calls so I kept more quiet than I probably should have seeing the extra ships coming in.
Don't second guess yourself, keeping an eye on the extra ships coming in was not your responsibility, and you did the right thing by keeping comms clear. In a fleet fight, the FC pretty much needs everybody else to shut up so they can keep a steady stream of orders going. Watching for incoming ships was my responsibility as FC, and I should have either done a better job keeping an eye on them or explicitly delegated the task of calling all new incoming hostiles to someone else.
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Analiese Aubernet
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Re: [AAR] Golden Horde 2018.04.30 - The Horde Cometh

Post by Analiese Aubernet »

To clarify a bit of what went on in Tama:

There is currently a group of pilots that is setting a trap on the novice plexes in Tama. They park a bait tanked punisher, and maybe another ship or two, on the gate to the plex at 0. When another pilot/group of pilots attempts to kill the Punisher, they decloak other ships around already in position at range around the plex. I've seen several Lokis (arty fit out to 130km), Sleipnirs, Orthruses, Comets, Confessors, you name it decloak around the plex.

What was called between the scouts was that HJ would go in and set off the trap, and I would come in second to try to tackle down one of the more valuable targets.

This didn't quite work out, but I thought it was a valiant attempt.
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Satoshi Tomeii
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Re: [AAR] Golden Horde 2018.04.30 - The Horde Cometh

Post by Satoshi Tomeii »

This was one of the best fleets I have been on so far. Though the last encounter was a bit rough, we managed to kill the Caracal.

The highlight was the two battleships for sure. That was some really exciting stuff. Everything worked out perfectly on that one.
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