[AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

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Reise Amatin
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[AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Reise Amatin »

FCC FEEDBACK
If you participated in the fleet, please leave feedback in the FCC Feedback form. The information you provide me will help me improve and lead better fleets, which leads to more fun for everyone.


FCC Feedback Form


ACTIONABLE GOALS
Improvement items to work on from my last fleet:
  • Pre-Roam Planning.
  • Decision Making.
  • Command Chatter.
PARTICIPANTS
Bubba Chee – Vanguard
Calder Ormand
Christoph Patrouette
Dilithium Tweaker
Drake Shea – 3IC, Logi
Gemma Solett
Harai Rex – 2IC
John Adams Viper – Vanguard
KPYTOE KOPOBO – Logi
Mols Halleck – Logi
Prince Tojo
Reise Amatin
Relentless Banality
Repression Namaste
Rouqaren Volant – Skirmish Scout
Satoshi Tomeii
Sone Eto – Skirmish Scout
Wokum
Xivik Skord
Zykey Jovakko


OBSERVATIONS
By a margin that isn't even CLOSE, this was simultaneously the WORST and in a sick, learn-best-when-you-get-the-$h!t-kicked-out-of-you kinda way, BEST fleet I've run. LSC is on vacation in Kamela, and I am spoiled getting 25+ participants on a Monday night/Tuesday morning. This week, I put out a note that we'd try Vexors, but in the event we didn't get numbers, bring a frigate for a kitchen sink roam. We had 10 Vexors, and by the time we were ready to undock we were down to 7 - don't ask how, I'm still not sure. It wasn't enough. I KNEW it wasn't enough. And I let myself get talked into taking them out anyway. What you see below is the result.

(03:07:30) Vey
Augoror -16.71m
Augoror -17.08m
Vexor -43.12m

(03:14:31) Ostingele
Capsule -0.01m

(03:41:14) Vlillirier
Condor -0.55m
Augoror -17.08m
Crucifier -1.67m
Magus -112.25m
Rifter -4.81m
Condor -0.57m
Atron -3.16m
Vigil -0.91m
Vexor -36.84m
Capsule -0.04m
Vexor -22.51m
Capsule -9.82m
Vexor -29.66m
Vexor -19.08m
Capsule -0.01m

(03:55:39) Vlillirier
Augoror -18.97m
Capsule -0.01m

(04:07:44) Ostingele
Federation Navy Comet -25.88m
Capsule - Genolution 'Auroral' 197-variant -0.01m

(04:18:56) Nennamaila
Maulus Navy Issue -21.04m
Maulus -6.36m
Condor -11.17m
Tristan -4.99m
Rifter -4.57m

(04:41:57) Nisuwa, Oinasiken
Kestrel -9.86m
Atron -5.65m
Griffin -1.03m
Atron -7.54m
Tristan -8.28m
Merlin -11.78m
Slasher -0.64m
Capsule -0.01m
Tristan -7.59m
Capsule -0.01m


Stats
ISK Destroyed: 0
ISK Lost: 481,280,507.55
ISK Delta: -481,280,507.55
Efficiency: 0%

That's right, 0% isk efficiency - a 100% red killboard. I am completely and utterly ashamed with myself for taking out a fleet that didn't have the necessary DPS to do ANYTHING resembling what the doctrine is capable of doing. Harai made a comment after the fleet - "I really don't like the BLAP Vexor doctrine, I think it's underpowered and doesn't perform well" (paraphrased). At the time, I completely agreed. BUT, if you go back and look at the BLAP Vexor fleet he took out for me the previous week (https://forum.eveuniversity.org/viewtop ... 6&t=108616), when we HAD THE RIGHT COMPOSITION, there's nothing wrong with the doctrine. You can't fly a BLAP Vexor fleet with only 7 DDs. I don't know if you can fly ANY doctrine fleet with only 7 DDs.

So, far and away the most horrific, shameful, pile of (#%*& of a fleet I've ever FCd. But I sure as hell got a big helping of the basics reinforced, and I learned that if your gut and your head are arguing, go with your gut. Your subconscious knows you're about to _@#!)(%*& yourself, go ahead and listen and save yourself the heartache and the remorse for leaving the lube at home.


PERFORMANCE REVIEW AND SUMMARY


Review/Attainment of Actionable Goals:
  • Pre-Roam Planning. - FAIL.
  • Decision Making. - FAIL. See above. 7 DDs? Reise, you are an IDIOT :D
  • Command Chatter. - Check-minus.
  • Keep LEARNING! - Check. This one just lives on this list - it's why we're doing the FCC, right?

Quality Improvement Actions for Next Fleet:
  • Pre-Roam Planning.
  • Decision Making.
  • Command Chatter.
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Drake Shea
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Re: [AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Drake Shea »

I did get my content after all :D I don't think it's needed to include my comet KM since I wasn't with the fleet, unless you're trying to shame me for welping into obvious bait :wink:
Fun fleet, and even though it was slower paced at the beginning than I'm used to, it was for the greater benefit of new pilots so 10/10 fleet. If only we killed something...
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Wokum
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Re: [AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Wokum »

Not a lot of km's but it was fun. That's what counts!
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Budda Sereda
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Re: [AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Budda Sereda »

Reise, I had similar feelings after my Spider Prophecies fleet. Don't take it so hard.

Honestly, it would be interesting to learn more details on engagements you had, I'm sure many can read and learn from that.

But I would disagree 7 vexors is not enough: they can kill certain things. They are not really mobile, but with some luck they should survive and shoot back...
Anyway, you will have good fleets :) keep it up.
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Decklin Quark Reiger
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Re: [AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Decklin Quark Reiger »

Just looking at the first two fleet fights you had, it looks like for the first one you were up against Shadow Cartel Bhaalgorns ( I assume with Guardian support)?

For the second, it was Exodus in Confessors, with a Cruor - I'd have to look on zkill for other fights they were in, to see if they were spider tanked, or of they had logi support, or if they were just kiting you out.


In both cases, I'd suggest that the thing to learn from this is more about recon than it is about not having enough pilots in fleet or the doctrine. It's really about knowing your opponents, knowing what your doctrine can (and can't) do, and having enough vision and scouting to get the fights you want.
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Drake Shea
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Re: [AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Drake Shea »

Decklin Quark Reiger wrote:Just looking at the first two fleet fights you had, it looks like for the first one you were up against Shadow Cartel Bhaalgorns ( I assume with Guardian support)?
Yes, they had guardian support. If memory serves we tried to burn down a lone bait bhaal before the rest of the fleet arrived, but he caught reps and the fleet came in quick. Luckily a scatter was called at a decent time so the whole fleet didn't welp.
Decklin Quark Reiger wrote:For the second, it was Exodus in Confessors, with a Cruor - I'd have to look on zkill for other fights they were in, to see if they were spider tanked, or of they had logi support, or if they were just kiting you out.
For this fight, we entered a medium PLEX and had all the DD at 0 and logi at roughly 20-30 km. Our scout got us a comp and we figured they had only logi for reps since they had a least 1 logi frig. What we didn't realize is that they were spider tanked and were able to melt through our 3 aug's reps. I do remember barely keeping Reise up with our reps, but I was doing full overheat with all my reps so his death was inevitable sadly. I know I would have made the same call to take the fight since they had logi, and I didn't even know spider confessors even existed.
Last edited by Drake Shea on 2018.03.06 12:51, edited 1 time in total.
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Budda Sereda
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Re: [AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Budda Sereda »

Nice way to guess what was on the grid, forgot that I can make an educated guess looking to killmails. Those Bhaals were traveling to Ostingele to bash POCOs... :) At least one of them: https://zkillboard.com/character/749550143/

yeah, Bhaals are like Heavy Tanks: don't stay on their way :)
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Alexander Oromov
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Re: [AAR] NoP Monday Roam! - 2018.02.27 @ 0200

Post by Alexander Oromov »

sometimes you win, sometimes you loose. nothing to be ashamed of. as long as everyone learns it's a success, always.
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