[AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

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Laser Skaron
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[AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

Post by Laser Skaron »

From: Captain Cean
To: Laser Skaron

hey i wanted to ask if you maybe want to fly logi by our t2 frigate Gang next monday.
So, a bit of German cuisine and a phrase book later, I hopped on with our rivals for a quick roam around space. Good ol' Cap'n Cean (TIL, it's pronounced Kean or Keen) asked for an AAR so let's dive. How's flying with the cookies different than the uni? No NDA was signed, so how many cookie secrets will I spill?

Now, before I go into the AAR, important fact: I don't know German. I can get a tiny bit of context but I have to consciously focus on the language to actually follow along a bit. For most of the fleet I was bouncing to the music, chilling, and just playing the game. Which is to say one can fly along without understanding the language but I can't say I'd recommend it. And this brings us to the most important tool HCOOK have: they got a bot that plays smooth jazz in comms. We NEED a bot that plays smooth jazz in comms!!

We undock a 36 man strong fleet for drills and we start going through black rise.
- 7 Logi (I think 6 were Deacons)
- ~7 Command desies (3 of which had booshes)
- ~4 Ceptors
- 3-4 Ewar/Utility support
- And everyone else in Assault Frigates and T1 armor frigs

And throughout most of the fleet we end up overwhelming pretty much everything we engage. It's quite a lenghy list of kills, so I won't cover them in detail and I won't go through every single one, but I will discuss the general atmosphere in the fleet and how it differs from a uni roam. After which you may bask in the green sea of kills below (I only whored on like 3-4 of them, so you won't really see my name to often if you click through).

1. It's nice to have the oomph. Damn I like a blob of T2 frigs + dessies. It's really nice to not feel "concerned" about half the things you encounter in space and be able to take the fights you want. I honestly don't want to take out a fleet that can't comfortably engage on gates anymore... It's also nice to see the damage applied (especially through friendly reps, when I repped the enemy at some point, oops). I could go a tiny bit into details about that as I've flown the last few logi runs with both targets and reps in the broadcast window - gives you a great perspective on how often we switch targets vs how often the enemies do. 1 Misclick and 1 language barrier later meant I repped an enemy Ashimu for far too long.

2. Intel arrives really fast and it arrives from 2 systems up ahead. I obviously didn't properly follow the chain of intel (because German) but scouts felt like they had a bit more autonomy and could look ahead a bit more freely than they do in the uni.

3. Acting on intel is much faster. This is partly to blame experience as an FC, but also an extensive use of ingame fleet mechanics. Lots of fleet warps, and quite a bit of good use of the recall mechanic. That button in the fleet window that no one presses is a great way to prepare the fleet for a boosh. I want to add that I couldn't understand which scout we were warping to (because German), but I did not fall behind the fleet once because fleet warps work. There were specific commands for logi throughout the fleet, and I've no clue what they were but I was still able to do my on grid duties without problems. Uni FCs, use those buttons that take take control of every boat you have way more often than you currently do and ignore the fact fleet mates aren't aligned when it doesn't matter.

4. FC bait/tackle. I'm not sure how to describe this and why this works, but very often I'd see Cean go through a gate and tell everyone else to stand by. Maybe call some logi with him for support. He'd then bait or tackle something on the other side of the gate, wait for aggression and then bring the hammer down from the other side of the gate. There's a couple reasons that aid him in this: being permaflashy makes him a bit juicier (target takes gate guns for granted) and incentivizes the target to shoot first. Also being in a super brick tanked ship helps with taking the risk and buying time. Guys, we're not gonna break Cean's blingy Pontifex anytime soon, just saying... If the target is not on a gate then FC gets first hand intel on warp ranges and stuff that may be in local. This is a tactic I've never seen in the uni and I love it.

5. No dedicated logi comms. I love my logi whisper key and I don't think this would work in the uni that well. But hey, one big happy public there.

(18:14:02) Martoh, Kehjari
Deacon -52.8m
Hyperion +334.17m
Tristan +6.68m
Capsule +102.73m

(18:29:40) Kinakka
Orthrus +494.3m
Atron +11.87m
Zealot +746.06m

(18:43:47) Hikkoken
Cyclone +60.25m

(18:45:35) Pynekastoh
Bantam +6.17m
Bantam +8.81m
Capsule +0.75m
Federation Navy Comet +27.32m

(18:54:09) Oinasiken
Rupture +22.35m

(18:56:55) Pynekastoh
Vexor +29.82m
Capsule +19.3m
Coercer -3.27m
Hecate +103.75m
Confessor +91.75m
Cormorant +3.55m
Cormorant +4.7m
Garmur +226.29m
Malediction +50.78m
Svipul +66.12m
Svipul +63.25m
Algos +44.41m
Garmur +275.05m

(19:22:45) Pynekastoh
Punisher +7.08m
Punisher +7.19m
Thrasher +10.75m

(19:29:24) Heydieles
Tayra +1.79m

(19:41:37) Old Man Star
Incursus +0.56m

(19:54:37) Nennamaila, Vlillirier
Daredevil +99.34m
Daredevil +216.11m
Daredevil +245.4m
Capsule +100.81m
Caldari Navy Hookbill +22.42m

(20:07:10) Kehjari
Moa +15.31m

Now, I mentioned there was one fight I had to talk about. Why this fight? 'cause I'm in a logi boat and it was most taxing from a logi perspective. During all other fights I didn't really need to use more than 1 rep at a time. I think I ended up consuming only 2-3 cap boosters up until this point (late in the fleet) and then chugged through half of my cargo space here.

We land on grid with a Hurricane that brings backup a few seconds after we land. This fight then lasts several minutes as we start punching through their boats slowly, one by one. They try and break us in turn. First they go for command desies, then for logi, and then they start burning off our tackle. We almost lose a few of them as they get taken out of logi range and have to burn back as we catch a friendly Stilleto in 15% hull and bring him back to life. For most of the fight I had to distribute reps towards our more fragile ships and keep our scouts up as the rest of the logi wing was easily holding our beefier ships between enemy target swaps. We lose a couple ewar boats eventualy but nothing compared to your foes.

(19:42:15) Nennamaila
Hurricane +76.17m
Augoror +37.08m
Curse +482.8m
Augoror +24.65m
Vexor +28.04m
Keres -55.77m
Ashimmu +177.78m
Tristan +12.18m
Ashimmu +167.13m
Crucifier -5.4m
Bhaalgorn +360.56m
Myrmidon +93.1m
Augoror +25.11m
Capsule +0.74m
Augoror +25.32m

Cookie stats on a good day:

ISK Destroyed: 5,037,759,250.39
ISK Lost: 117,228,902.97
ISK Delta: 4,920,530,347.42
Efficiency: 97.726%

[Edit] Removed a bunch of empty capsules from the report. We pod waaay less in the uni than these guys... sec status _sigh_. But there was only 1 pod down during the last fight unlike all the other grids where we had plenty of time and spare ewar to catch them.
Last edited by Laser Skaron on 2017.10.24 08:57, edited 4 times in total.
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Rose Alice
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Re: [AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

Post by Rose Alice »

It's amazing what some t2 frigs, t3d with logi can actually take on, I personally prefer CD over T3d especially if we are roaming due to warp speed.

You mentioned at one point about repping a energy ashimmu. I'm sure you know this but your ale to already what is broad casted and change the colour as well.
Personal I have done targets set to red. Broadcast as green then travel request as blue.
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Laser Skaron
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Re: [AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

Post by Laser Skaron »

Rose Alice wrote: You mentioned at one point about repping a energy ashimmu. I'm sure you know this but your ale to already what is broad casted and change the colour as well.
Personal I have done targets set to red. Broadcast as green then travel request as blue.
Ye, I got that covered, but it took me ages to realise that I misclicked on an enemy, and that was further amplified by not understanding on grid commands in German. Absolutely no jokes were made about this XD (sarcasm).

Unrelated to the actual roam: Normally in the uni we recommend disabling target broadcasts for logi and disabling rep broadcasts for the main fleet. But I found that having both on gives me a better overview of who is winning the fight, and I am often in a position where I am one of the people communicating that to the FC, or being the FC.
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Sakul Aubaris
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Re: [AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

Post by Sakul Aubaris »

One Cookie here.
Unfortunally i was not present, but reading EVE Uni AAR reports with cookies involved is always fun :)
And this brings us to the most important tool HCOOK have: they got a bot that plays smooth jazz in comms. We NEED a bot that plays smooth jazz in comms!!
YES! YOU NEED THIS!
Seriosly its nice and everyone who does not like it just mutes the bot and is fine.
Win - Win.
5. No dedicated logi comms. I love my logi whisper key and I don't think this would work in the uni that well. But hey, one big happy public there.

Well. :idea: I guess it might be possible that there is a dedicatet logi wishper list the next roam you join us...
Just saying...
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Kora K
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Re: [AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

Post by Kora K »

Seems like a lot of fun, especially those T2/T3 armor ships :) I need to learn germans now
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Budda Sereda
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Re: [AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

Post by Budda Sereda »

List of kills looks impressive, 5B of kills... in 2 hours... Though, 36 gang fleet in Black Rise... sounds like too much. From the other side, you can engage and brawl ANYTHING you want...

Yes, T2 frigates are awesome! We should fly them more often. But I can't say we can only engage on the gates with T2. T1 still can do pretty well.

Regarding scouts freedom: please don't consider as boasting but those who joined "The Crazy 8's" fleets I ran in low-sec felt something similar.

Regarding warping fleet: TBH, I personally is very bored when FC warps fleet and the only thing I need to do is hitting 'Jump' or 'F1'.
If the target is not on a gate then FC gets first-hand intel on warp ranges and stuff that may be in local. This is a tactic I've never seen in the uni and I love it.
True. The only problem is we don't fly t2 fleets. At all. Almost at all. Hopefully, FCC graduates will stay with E-Uni and eventually run T2 as well. Maybe soon even T2 CRs?
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Laser Skaron
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Re: [AAR] The Erasmus (feat Holy Cookie)

Post by Laser Skaron »

Budda Sereda wrote:List of kills looks impressive, 5B of kills... in 2 hours... Though, 36 gang fleet in Black Rise... sounds like too much. From the other side, you can engage and brawl ANYTHING you want...
That was primarily my point, that you can engage almost anything and you don't have to sneak around fights, not that the fact it's a T2 fleet.
Budda Sereda wrote:True. The only problem is we don't fly t2 fleets. At all. Almost at all. Hopefully, FCC graduates will stay with E-Uni and eventually run T2 as well. Maybe soon even T2 CRs?
I think that's less of a problem than we expecte, I mean no one requires that we bring ONLY T2, there were a few newbros even in the cookie fleet. I'm perfectly happy with 30% of the fleet being T2 if we take them out. I also never claimed that you can't fight on gates because you are T1, tho only having 3 Bursts makes it difficult at times. My point there was just that it's harder to pull the trigger in those scenarios.

I will make it a personal point tho, I see no reason to restrict people to T1 ships when taking out frigates in my rare fleets in the future.
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