[AAR] Ratting in Uph: easy pvp experience for newbie

[DeanSherman]

I'm more interested in fleets than solo pvp, i go on fleets and lose sec status, then i go ratting to get sec status.
I use Algos with blasters.

Spoiler

[Algos, Algos]
Damage Control II
Small Armor Repairer II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

1MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier

Modal Light Ion Particle Accelerator I
Modal Light Ion Particle Accelerator I
Modal Light Ion Particle Accelerator I
Modal Light Ion Particle Accelerator I
Modal Light Ion Particle Accelerator I
Small Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer

Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Small Anti-Kinetic Pump I
Small Anti-Thermal Pump I



Hobgoblin II x8
Hammerhead I x2

Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S x1000
Antimatter Charge S x1000

Aug 24.
I'm on a belt with 3 cruiser rats. I see this guy https://zkillboard.com/character/91310024/ in local. Tormentor on long d. Need to finish at least 1 rat to reduce their damage. Tormentor on short d. Returning hammerheads, deploying hobgoblins, need to change to faction ammo. Tormentor on grid, landed at 0, i'm ~20 away. Orbit 500, AB on, lock. Activate webs, drones. He burns to me and in range and i still have standard antimatter loaded. 5 seconds is long time, let's shoot now and overheat guns. Activate neut. Shields gone, activate and overheat armor repairer. Well, that's all, i look at range and my hitpoints and his hitpoints and do nothing. When I have 30% sctructure he warps away with same structure left.

I think he was buffer tanked. I did not see his drones. I should have changed to faction antimatter, i lost more damage over time of fight. I could deactivate webs when he was in structure to secure kill. I was waiting for a fight, but i was not well prepared. I took this fight because there were 2 more rats to kill on the belt.


https://zkillboard.com/kill/64266729/
I'm doing something docked at the station. Gwathela is attacked by Harbinger on a belt. I jump into Griffin, warp at 50 and want to jam, but Gwathela warps out. Harbinger does not have scram or point? I'm confused.
Gwathela tackles harbinger on another belt. I'm absolutely sure that we can not kill battlecruiser with frigate and destroyer. I warp at bookmark at the belt and look what's going on. There is clone soldier on the belt. Gwathela takes damage, warps away. Then i see how harbinger can not kill clone soldier and warps away. I'm very confused. I kill clone soldier.
We warp between belts and station, we can not engage him on the station.
Gwathela tackles harbinger again on a belt. There is battleship rat on the belt. We orbit harbinger at 500. He deploys warriors. I double web warriors, we kill them. He deploys hammerheads. We kill them. Now all fire on harbinger. We are slowly breaking his reps. Harbinger explodes.

His fit was bad and rat did 50% damage. Probably he lost all cap, at the end of the fight he used nosferatu on me. His long or medium range weapons could not hit small targets at close range, without drones he was helpless.


Aug 25.
https://zkillboard.com/kill/64273568/
I'm on Dastryns gate with 2 bc rats. I kill them and when i loot them, i see gate flash, flashy name in local, tristan breaks cloak. He yellowboxes me, deploys hobgoblins. I yellowbox him, deploy hobgoblins, reloading to faction ammo. He can not engage me on the gate. I think what if it is bait and when i get weapons timer dozen tristans will jump into system. May be i should align to a bookmark first? But blasters are short range, i can not apply damage from distance. Orbit 500, activate and overheat guns, activate neut, drones engage, activate webs, activate and overheat armor repairer. I look here and there, things look good, tristan explodes scratching my structure a bit.

I took this fight because i saw his hobgoblins. Not sure if i took the fight vs warriors.


https://zkillboard.com/kill/64273794/
I was ratting, i did not want to fight Dragoon, i came to plex to help another unista, but he already warped out.
I decided to stay and take the fight.
I saw that i was losing, so i should try to break scram range with my webs and warp out.

I did not have plan for the fight. I think he had buffer tank. May be i should go for drones first?


I fitted railguns on new Algos.

Spoiler

[Algos, Algos]
Damage Control II
Small Armor Repairer II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

1MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier
Faint Epsilon Scoped Warp Scrambler

125mm Prototype Gauss Gun
125mm Prototype Gauss Gun
125mm Prototype Gauss Gun
125mm Prototype Gauss Gun
125mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Small Infectious Scoped Energy Neutralizer

Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Small Anti-Kinetic Pump I
Small Anti-Thermal Pump I



Hobgoblin II x8
Hammerhead I x2

Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S x1000
Antimatter Charge S x1000

https://zkillboard.com/kill/64277117/
I log in, see unfamiliar name in local. Check killboard, undock, coercer in a plex, dock. I can not go ratting. What if I find clone soldier and Coercer jumps on me same time? I have to kill it now, safety first. I know a little about amarr ships and lasers. Check range and tracking of his lasers and ammo. I think my railguns have better tracking and better range. I will orbit him at 5000, inside my optimal, outside his optimal, screw his tracking a bit.
Undock, warp to plex, slide. He is at 20. Approach, lock, deploy drones. Drones engage. Activate and overheat guns. Activate webs. Activate neut, stop ship at 5, orbit, activate and overheat armor repairer. Something wrong, he hits every round. I don't have spare plan, i just wait. Coercer explodes, my ship has 16% sctructure left.

After the fight i simulate his fit. Why his tracking is better? I think, it is Coercer traits, i forgot to check it. I took the fight because i thought i had a plan, but my plan was completely wrong.


Aug 27.
https://zkillboard.com/kill/64313815/
I want to do PI, but there are cal mil algos, cormorant and tristan in the system. How can i undock epithal? What if they jump on POCO and destroy my ship during align time? I have to kill them all. It is just self-defense. I ask for help in chat, but it takes time.
Undock, go for cormorant. Slide into plex. He is 20 away. He quickly burns to me, he has blasters, but i don't care about range control, i spam 1 au d-scan in case other cal mil ships come. I think i just hit keep at range 5000, overheat guns and armor repairer, activate other modules.
Cormorant explodes, my ship has 50% structure.

I did not have a particular plan, i thought that my thermal/kinetic resistances gave me good chance to brawl against blasters or time to escape from railguns.


Thoughts.
Destroyer pvp looks easier than frigate. Fights are shorter, destroyers have almost same tank and twice dps. I don't need to manage cap or heat. Destroyers are slower, i can not manual piloting 3000 m/s MWD frigate.
Algos has drones, drones have their own tracking and optimal. Algos has bonuses for hybrid turrets tracking, so i can just be in range and don't think much about transversal.
I took fights either vs t1 frigates or t1 destroyers, i think that i can not fight navy or pirate frigates with algos. I don't want to fight anything that can do explosive damage with my PVE fit.

[Budda Sereda]

i can not manual piloting 3000 m/s MWD frigate.

If you want to be a good PvPer, you need to learn. Try watching these videos to get an idea https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yBTaqi ... XUzZhubC7Z and the rest of video from ChessurSB in his 'Small Gang Archetype' playlist.

[Breeze One]

Great read and some nice kills

Love that you're getting (and winning) fights while doing something else!

On the Coercer by the way, Pulses will always out-track Railguns. Pulse Lasers are short range weapons with great tracking, designed for close range combat. Look at the tracking speed column on the wiki page comparing the turrets:

https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Turrets# ... Comparison

Its not just the Coercer bonus - his weapons do just track better than yours

If it was a pure PvP fit I'd suggest looking at switching the T2 Repaier for a SAAR, but I guess thats because you use it for PvE primarily, where sustained repping power is more valuable than burst reps?

[DeanSherman]

If you want to be a good PvPer, you need to learn.

I just want to learn how to protect myself from dirty pirates.

Its not just the Coercer bonus - his weapons do just track better than yours

I think i looked at wrong lasers or wrong stat of lasers then.

If it was a pure PvP fit I'd suggest looking at switching the T2 Repaier for a SAAR, but I guess thats because you use it for PvE primarily, where sustained repping power is more valuable than burst reps?

Yes, i don't want to use SAAR for PvE or refit every time i need to shoot someone.

[Decklin Quark Reiger]

Very very good write-up, Dean

I really liked the way you shared your thinking process there

Also, I'm very proud of your kills I remember when you first joined the LSC. Great decision making and planning there

[Eddie Dante]

Nice write up, Ive had the same experience with destroyers: theyre easier to start pvp in then (some?) frigates. Less modules to manage. When in a short range fit, just approach the enemy. No worries about heat damage or cap. (disclaimer: this is ofc a bit of a generalisation, but quite a difference with a dual rep scram kite breacher for example)

[DeanSherman]

https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Safety_T ... in_Low_Sec

Never warp to 0 when destination is unknown

If you are going to rescue a friend, you want to warp to your weapons optimal range. If you are going to an asteroid belt or similar location, you want to warp in a long way off (60km+ at least) so you can see what is waiting there for you before you are close enough to engage. If you are losing a fight and warp away, any half skilled pirate will be able to figure out where you have gone and warp after you. They will warp to 0 hoping to catch you. The only time you might want to warp to 0 is when you are warping to a gate or docking at a station so you can jump/dock right away. Be careful, though, when warping to a gate -- a properly positioned and fit battleship can use smart bombs to kill small ships (like frigates) as they warp in. This can happen often in the areas of low sec that act as short cuts from from one part of high sec to another. If you are not sure that the gate you are jumping to is safe, warp to it at a far distance (or a tactical bookmark: see next tip) and check it out first. If it is clear, warp to somewhere else then back to the gate at 0 and jump.

I lost two Algoses, one to Raido, one to NPC.

https://zkillboard.com/kill/64630127/
I was on a belt, Exequror landed, i did not want to take fight with rats on belt, warped to home station. I saw medium plex was open and warped there. I used 5 degree d-scan to make sure it was clear. I wanted to slide, pull range, kill his drones. Unfortunately he was already there. May be i bumped a bit by acceleration gate, could not slide. Tried to kill his drones, but did not use my drones, because i still tried to slide.

https://zkillboard.com/kill/64714520/
I wanted to warp at 50 and snipe with drones.
I warped to escalation site, bookmarked it, aligned out, but was pointed and webbed before i could warp away. Overheated everything, killed almost all tackle frigates.

I wanted to try another destroyer or another Algos fit, but could not fit anything better, and stayed with fit from last lossmail.

Spoiler

[Algos, Ratting]
Damage Control II
Small Armor Repairer II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier
1MN Afterburner II
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier

Modal Light Neutron Particle Accelerator I
Modal Light Neutron Particle Accelerator I
Modal Light Neutron Particle Accelerator I
Small Gremlin Compact Energy Neutralizer
Modal Light Neutron Particle Accelerator I
Modal Light Neutron Particle Accelerator I

Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Small Anti-Thermal Pump I
Small Auxiliary Nano Pump I



Hobgoblin II x8
Federation Navy Hammerhead x2

Antimatter Charge S x1000
Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S x1000

Sep 17.

I'm ratting in Uph, i see this guy https://zkillboard.com/character/1585780746/ in local. Imperial Navy Slicer on long d-scan. On short d-scan. Align out. He lands on belt, i warp away. Can i fight? His ship is locked to EM/Thermal and this is my highest resistances. I guess, he is very fast and can outrun my hobgoblins, so i pick a flight of warriors. He leaves system, i try to kill Serpentis battleship rat, he comes back. He lands at 20 from me, i try to approach, but he is much faster. Align out, overheat armor repairer. Drones engage, repeat every 2-3 seconds. He orbits me at 20-22, i think i can not slingshot with our speed differences. I just keep aligning. I'm in half structure, my drones start breaking his armor. Overheat AB, press "warp to" every second. He is at 24, still has point. He is at 32? Warp away with 35% structure and burned down armor repairer.

I think he had SAAR fitted and when he used all charges he tried to change orbit to reduce damage from drones, but made a mistake. Actually i was going to wait him at 0 at belt without rats, try to catch him with webs and burst with blasters before he could pull range.


https://zkillboard.com/kill/64738262/
Some time ago i made some bookmarks on belts in Dastryns and Iges.
I find nothing interesting in Dastryns, move to Iges. One Serpentis battleship, nice. Another Serpentis battleship, very nice! Iges is quiet, 3 Tengus doing missions somewhere, there is some traffic.
Succubus on long d-scan. On short d-scan. Can i fight? It is EM/Thermal damage type and he should be slower than Slicer. Warp to bookmark at belt. There is Serpentis battleship with two cruisers. Succubus lands at 0. I can warp to him, but don't want to fight with rats. I warp to previous cleared belt. Deploy drones, pre-heat everything. I wait. He lands at 0, great! He is 3500 from me, lock, approach, activate AB, pre-activate blasters, neut, webs. Looks like he does not try to pull range, just scrams and shoots me. Target locked, drones engage. Succubus explodes very fast.

I think that he wanted to orbit me at optimal of his short range fit/ammo, and did not expect blasters and double webs.

Thoughts.
May be i can fight faction frigate if it lands at 0 or at 10. Unfortunately, i am usually 20-50 km from 0 when ratting.
May be i should carry long range ammo? But drones are my long range ammo and i probably have range control for 10-12 km web range.

[Raido Kudonen]

I was on a belt, Exequror landed, i did not want to take fight with rats on belt, warped to home station. I saw medium plex was open and warped there. I used 5 degree d-scan to make sure it was clear. I wanted to slide, pull range, kill his drones. Unfortunately he was already there. May be i bumped a bit by acceleration gate, could not slide. Tried to kill his drones, but did not use my drones, because i still tried to slide.

1) I'm 99% sure you bumped; it looked like you landed inside the gate model and that sucks. Warping at 10 to the gate prevents this problem. In related info, I'm not sure if you know this, but you can't slide accel gates when either pointed or scrammed (LSC people thought you could slide while pointed for the longest time even after I tested it, but this is false).

2) I don't know if you're familiar with rat aggro mechanics, but people who warp into anoms typically expect the rats to switch to them when you land - I'm not sure if the rat AI in belts is the same, but probably. So you'd actually benefit from the damage switch. (I thought you were baiting for some of the other people in local, actually.)

I'm ratting in Uph, i see this guy https://zkillboard.com/character/1585780746/ in local. Imperial Navy Slicer on long d-scan. On short d-scan. Align out. He lands on belt, i warp away. Can i fight? His ship is locked to EM/Thermal and this is my highest resistances. I guess, he is very fast and can outrun my hobgoblins, so i pick a flight of warriors. He leaves system, i try to kill Serpentis battleship rat, he comes back. He lands at 20 from me, i try to approach, but he is much faster. Align out, overheat armor repairer. Drones engage, repeat every 2-3 seconds. He orbits me at 20-22, i think i can not slingshot with our speed differences. I just keep aligning. I'm in half structure, my drones start breaking his armor. Overheat AB, press "warp to" every second. He is at 24, still has point. He is at 32? Warp away with 35% structure and burned down armor repairer.

He most likely noped out because he ran out of cap. The Slicer has only about 30s cap life with the SAAR running (4 rep cycles) - if you count 4 rep cycles, he has to stop repping or leave if you keep damaging him through that.

[Budda Sereda]

He most likely noped out because he ran out of cap. The Slicer has only about 30s cap life with the SAAR running (4 rep cycles) - if you count 4 rep cycles, he has to stop repping or leave if you keep damaging him through that.

I'm curious, what would happen if slicer pilot pulsed his MWD,I guess with luck and skills he would be able to save some cap and get his opponent down? Especially, if he fights against AB fit.

[DeanSherman]

1) I'm 99% sure you bumped; it looked like you landed inside the gate model and that sucks. Warping at 10 to the gate prevents this problem. In related info, I'm not sure if you know this, but you can't slide accel gates when either pointed or scrammed (LSC people thought you could slide while pointed for the longest time even after I tested it, but this is false).

2) I don't know if you're familiar with rat aggro mechanics, but people who warp into anoms typically expect the rats to switch to them when you land - I'm not sure if the rat AI in belts is the same, but probably. So you'd actually benefit from the damage switch. (I thought you were baiting for some of the other people in local, actually.)

Yes, i know i can not slide when tackled, but i did not have a plan for fight in short range. I thought that i could use webs to get out from scram range, but it was too late.

I read somewhere that rats more likely to attack similar size targets, so in fight vs cruiser i'd probably benefit from it, but not in fights vs frigates.

[Raido Kudonen]

I'm curious, what would happen if slicer pilot pulsed his MWD,I guess with luck and skills he would be able to save some cap and get his opponent down? Especially, if he fights against AB fit.

You can do that, and some of us generally would do that if we were that close to getting a kill - but note that if you do that, the bad guys' drones will suddenly apply perfectly to you in a big burst of damage. So it's a high-risk play, and for an Algos kill it's a rather low potential reward.